CHARTER REVIEW 04/27/00 **NOTIFICATION: **This is not an official, verbatim transcript of the following **meeting. It should be used for informational purposes only. **This document has not been edited; therefore, there may be **additions, deletions, or words that did not translate. >> JAN SMITH: GOOD EVENING, I WOULD LIKE TO WELCOME YOU TO THE APRIL 27 MEETING OF THE CHARTER REVIEW BOARD HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY. IF I MAY FOR A MOMENT APOLOGIZE FOR WHERE WE ARE AND WHERE WE ARE SUPPOSED TO BE CONFUSION. HERE WE ARE ON THE 26TH FLOOR OF THE COUNTY CENTER AND WE ARE STARTING THIS MEETING A HALF HOUR LATE DUE TO PROBLEMS WITH RELOCATING PEOPLE TO BE ABLE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE COULD BRING THIS MEETING LIVE TO THE VIEWING AUDIENCE . THANK YOU FOR YOUR INDULGENCE, AND I AGAIN APOLOGIZE FOR THE MISCOMMUNICATION, BUT WE'LL GET RIGHT TO WORK . ARLENE WALDRON, WOULD YOU PLEASE LEAD THE PLEDGE? >> I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC, FOR WHICH IT STANDS, ONE ANYWAY, UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL . MY APOLOGIES TO MY CLERK, SUE WEST . THANK YOU FOR RELOCATING, BRINGING EVERYTHING UP HERE . WILL YOU PLEASE CALL THE ROLL? (ROLL CALL) . >> JAN SMITH: BEFORE WE GET INTO THE DETAIL OF THE MEETING, WE WOULD LIKE TO TELL YOU ALL WE HAD YOUR PACKETS READY TO GO OUT ON WEDNESDAY . WE THOUGHT IF WE HELD UP A DAY, WE WOULD HAVE MINUTES TO COME OUT TO ALL OF THE BOARD MEMBERS ALSO . THAT DIDN'T PAN OUT . WE HELD THEM UP, THEN WHEN BARBARA DELIVERED THEM TO THE COUNTY FOR MAILING, ASSUMING THAT IF WE GAVE THEM TO THEM FRIDAY MORNING, SINCE WE DIDN'T GET THE MINUTES, THAT THEY WOULD GO OUT FRIDAY . IT WAS A MISTAKE ON OUR PART, BECAUSE AS MOST OF YOU KNOW, IF YOU GOT YOUR PACKET, IT WASN'T DATED UNTIL MONDAY MORNING, ALTHOUGH I DO UNDERSTAND THAT SOME OF THE PEOPLE THAT LIVED IN THE CITY DID GET IT EVEN THOUGH IT WAS MAILED TO YOU ON MONDAY . HARD TO UNDERSTAND HOW WE HAD THREE WEEKS BETWEEN MEETINGS AND COULDN'T GET THE PACKET OUT ON TIME AND I APOLOGIZE IN THE FUTURE . I'M NOT GOING TO WAIT FOR THE MINUTES . IF WE DON'T HAVE THE MINUTES IN TIME TO MAIL THE PACKETS, WE WILL MAIL THEM SO YOU WILL HAVE THEM HOPEFULLY BY THE WEEKEND BEFORE THE NEXT MEETING . I THINK THAT IS THE BETTER WAY TO HANDLE IT . MR. BALLARD, YOU DIDN'T GET THE MINUTES, I DON'T THINK . DID YOU GET A COPY OF THEM THIS EVENING? >> YES, ALL SET . >> THEN WE SHOULD, IF EVERYONE HAS HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO READ THE MINUTES, ARE THERE ANY ADDITIONS OR CORRECTIONS TO THE MINUTES? MAY I HAVE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE MINUTES? (MOTION MADE BY MR. BELTRAN, SECONDED BY MR. WHITE TO APPROVE THE MINUTES OF PREVIOUS MEETING; CARRIED). >> JAN SMITH: WE WILL START THIS EVENING WITH PUBLIC COMMENTS . IS THERE ANYONE HERE WHO WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS THE CHARTER REVIEW BOARD AT THE BEGINNING OF THE MEETING? AND THEN THAT'S AN OPPORTUNITY FOR YOU TO SPEAK AND NOT TO SPEND AN EVENING WITH US, IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO SAY SOMETHING NOW, BUT YOU DO NOT HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY THEN TO SPEAK AT THE END OF THE MEETING .MR. WARREN? THANKS FOR COMING AGAIN . >> MR. WARREN: GOOD EVENING, LADIES AND GENTLEMEN . FIRST, FROM CONVERSATION OF THE LAST MEETING I HAVE BROUGHT SOMEONE WHO WILL GO FIRST . >> MS. WALLACE: I LIVE AT 6711, VILLAGE GROVE COURT, AND BECAUSE OF THE TIME CONSTRAINT AND LENGTH OF MY PRESENTATION I WOULD RATHER DEFER MY TIME TO MR. CARL WARREN, SR. . >> MR. WARREN: THANK YOU . I WOULD LIKE TO ALSO SUBMIT 15 COPIES OF MY PRESENTATION ALONG WITH SOME COLUMNS THAT I HAVE DONE ON VARIOUS PROPOSALS AND ISSUES, 14 FOR BOARD MEMBERS, AND ONE FOR MISS MARY . I WOULD LIKE TO SUBMIT THESE . CARL WARREN, TAMPA, FLORIDA . MEMBERS, I WOULD LIKE TO ASK YOU THREE QUESTIONS THAT ARE STRONGLY RELATED TO THE PROPOSED CHANGES . I AM ABOUT TO REQUEST FOR YOUR INDIVIDUAL AND COLLECTIVE CONSIDERATION THIS EVENING, THESE CHANGES . ONE, WILL AN INDIVIDUAL THAT IS A CITIZEN OR AN ADMINISTRATIVE STAFF PERSON AND/OR A BOCC STAFF PERSON BE IN VIOLATION OF THE FLORIDA SUNSHINE LAW IF THAT PERSON SERVES AS A CONDUIT, BY DEPRIVING ANOTHER BOCC MEMBER OR ANOTHER COUNTY ADMINISTRATIVE MEMBER A POSITION ON A MATTER WHICH FOR SILVER ACTIONS WILL BE TAKEN BY THE BOCC. WILL THIS PERSON BE IN VIOLATION OF THE SUNSHINE? 2, DOES THE SUNSHINE LAW APPLY TO ANY MEETING WHERE THE FORM OF -- BETWEEN TWO OR MORE BOARD MEMBERS TO DISCUSS ANY MATTER UPON WHICH ANY SILVER ACTIONS WILL BE TAKEN BY THE BOCC . AND THIRD, IS ANY INDIVIDUAL CITIZEN OR AN ADMINISTRATIVE STAFF PERSON AND/OR A BOCC STAFF PERSON SUBJECTED TO THE SUNSHINE LAW IF SHE OR HE IS INTENTIONALLY USING A RELATION FOR THE ADMINISTRATOR OR FOR THE BOCC BY CONVEYING OR CIRCULATING INFORMATION OR THOUGHTS TO THE REST OF THE BOCC? I STRONGLY BELIEVE SUCH QUESTIONS NEED PROPER LEGAL ANSWERS . I STRONGLY BELIEVE THERE EXISTS AN INHERENT TENSION AND INEVITABLE CONFLICT FOR EFFECTIVE DECISION-MAKING IN THE PRESENT HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY GOVERNMENT STRUCTURE . I BELIEVE THIS INHERENT TENSION AND INEVITABLE CONFLICT ARE COMPOUNDED WITH THE SUNSHINE LAW WHICH ULTIMATELY ENCOURAGES INORDINATE EXCESS AND GREATER OPPORTUNITY OF AND FOR THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR AND HIS STAFF AND SERVING AS CONDUITS, LOBBYING, SIZING UP, OR IN MANIPULATING THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS IN SEEMINGLY LEGAL BUT SHAMELESS WAYS . I BELIEVE THIS INORDINATE STRUCTURAL RELATIONSHIP ALLOWS THE ADMINISTRATOR AND HIS STAFF TO DIRECTLY IMPACT POLICY OUTCOME MORE DEFINITIVELY THAN THOSE COMMISSIONERS ELECTED TO FORMULATE AND MAKE POLICY . I BELIEVE A DOUBLE NEGATIVE IMPACT OCCURS FROM THE STRUCTURED SUPERORDINARY RELATIONSHIP WHEN THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATORS TOO HAVE THE STRUCTURAL POWER TO IMPLEMENT, IGNORE AND ADMINISTER THOSE POLICIES WHICH HAVE BEEN MANIPULATIVELY PROMULGATED BY THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR AND HIS STAFF . AS YOU KNOW, THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS IS STRUCTURALLY RESTRICTED FROM MICROMANAGING OR TAMPERING WITH THE DAY-TO-DAY OPERATIONS OF COUNTY GOVERNMENT . I STRONGLY BELIEVE THIS SUPERORDINARY STRUCTURED ROLE IN FACT ALLOWS THE APPOINTED COUNTY ADMINISTRATION POSITION TO FUNCTION AS A TACIT ADD HOC MAYOR WITHOUT ANY ACCOUNTABILITY . I BELIEVE THAT EACH OF YOU RECOGNIZE THAT A ROSE BY ANY OTHER NAME IS STILL A ROSE . I BELIEVE THE INHERENT TENSION AND CONFLICT IS ASSOCIATED WITH THE SUPERORDINAL STRATEGIC POSITION OF THE STRUCTURED COUNTY ADMINISTRATION AND HIS STAFF ROLE FOR BEING CONDUIT FOR BOTH THE ADMINISTRATORS AND FOR BOCC MEMBERS . I BELIEVE THIS STRUCTURE INEVITABLY LEADS TO DEVISIVENESS AND CONFLICT BETWEEN STAFF AND BOCC MEMBERS . I BELIEVE STRUCTURALIZATION PLACES THE BALANCE OF POWER AND INFLUENCES THE STRUCTURED ROLE OF THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR AND HIS STAFF . I DO NOT BELIEVE IT IS THE INTENT OF FLORIDA LEGISLATORS TO HAVE CREATED SUCH AN IMBALANCED POWER FOR BOCC WITH ITS ADMINISTRATOR AND ITS STAFF . I BELIEVE THE STRUCTURAL ALLOW IT IS TAIL TO WAG THE DOG . I BELIEVE THIS STRUCTURAL WAGON BEGS FOR RECOMMENDED STRUCTURAL CHANGES TO THE VOTERS FROM THIS CHARTER REVIEW BOARD . I STRONGLY BELIEVE A STRUCTURAL CHANGE IS NECESSARY FOR LEVELLING THE PLAYING FIELD BETWEEN THE COUNTY AND BOCC AND THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR AND HIS STAFF, GIVEN THE FACT -- GIVEN THE FACT -- I REALIZE THAT MANY CITIZENS BELIEVE PERSONAL RELATIONSHIP STYLES AND PERSONALITY PLAY A MOST IMPORTANT ROLE IN THE EFFECTIVE ADMINISTRATION OF GOVERNMENT AND POLICY-MAKING . I STRONGLY BELIEVE SUCH QUESTIONS ARE IMPORTANT, BUT I, TOO, KNOW A WELL STRUCTURED, ACCOUNTABLE SYSTEM, IS MORE CAPABLE OF COMPENSATING FOR THE LIGHT THEREOF. I PROPOSE IN THE EVENT THE CHARTER REVIEW BOARD, WILL KEEP THE SAME BOCC STRUCTURE, SPECIFIC LANGUAGE SHOULD BE ADDED TO THE CHARTER THAT WOULD CLEARLY ESTABLISH LEGAL PARAMETERS WHEREIN THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR AND HIS STAFF CANNOT MAINTAIN SUCH INORDINATE ADVANTAGES OVER THEIR BOSSES. I BELIEVE THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR SHOULD BE LIMITED IN THEIR ROLES WHEN ACTION WILL IMPACT ON THE BOCC . I STRONGLY BELIEVE THAT ON MATTERS OF POLICY DECISION-MAKING OR ADMINISTRATIVE INPUT FROM THE BOCC STAFF AND OTHER PUBLIC DISCUSSION INPUT WHICH LEADS TO DECISION-MAKING. SUCH INPUT OR DISCUSSION SHOULD BE MADE IN THE SUNSHINE . IN CONCLUSION, I BELIEVE SOME FORM OF SUNSHINE LIMITS BETWEEN THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR AND THE STAFF WITH ANY BOCC MEMBERS AS OUTLINED BY COUNTY ATTORNEY, TO THEN COUNTY ACTION TO JOE CHILURRA ON OCTOBER 16, 1991 WOULD STRIKE THE INTEGRITY AND OVERALL POLICY AND ADMINISTRATIVE PROGRESS OF THE HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY GOVERNMENT . ALSO I BELIEVE THAT SUCH LANGUAGE PLACED IN THE CHARTER SHOULD HELP TO SILENCE THE CRITICISM OF QUESTIONING SELF-EMPOWERMENT OF A NON-ELECTED COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR AND HIS STAFF OVER THE ELECTED BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS . I BELIEVE SUCH ACCESS RESTRICTION LANGUAGE SHOULD PLACE A BUFFER BETWEEN THE BOCC AND THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR AND HIS STAFF . I BELIEVE THIS BUFFER CAN FUEL -- >>JAN SMITH: MR. WARREN, YOUR TEN MINUTES IS UP . CAN YOU BRING YOUR COMMENTS TO A CLOSE? >> MR. WARREN: I BELIEVE ANOTHER IMPORTANT MATTER THAT NEEDS CONSIDERATION IN THE OVERALL SCHEME OF THINGS IS TO ESTABLISH EMPLOYMENT CRITERIA FOR THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR CREDENTIALS OR QUALIFICATIONS . I BELIEVE SUCH CREDENTIALS SHOULD REFLECT BROAD TRAINING AND EXPERIENCE RATHER THAN BE RESTRICTED TO PUBLIC ADMINISTRATION BACKGROUND. I BELIEVE THE EMPLOYMENT CRITERIA OUGHT TO REQUIRE AS A MINIMUM QUALIFICATION SOME COMPARABLE EXECUTIVE LEADERSHIP BACKGROUND AND/OR TRADE ENDEAVORS WHICH REVEALS COMPETENCY FOR ADMINISTRATION OF COUNTY GOVERNMENT. >> JAN SMITH: MR. WARREN, I BELIEVE YOU NEED TO COMPLETE YOUR "I BELIEVES" AT THE NEXT MEETING . WE KNOW YOU ARE GOING TO COME TO EVERY ONE OF OUR MEETINGS . >>MR. WARREN: I JUST HAVE ONE CLOSING STATEMENT. >> JAN SMITH: MAKE IT BRIEF. >>MR. WARREN: I BELIEVE THAT THE ACTION MEMORANDUM TO QUESTIONS THAT ARE OPEN, WILL SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES . SHE HAS ASKED THESE QUESTIONS AND I BELIEVE THAT THIS CHARTER REVIEW BOARD SHOULD INCLUDE SUCH LANGUAGE IN THE CHARTER TO REFLECT SUCH RESTRICTIONS . >> JAN SMITH: THANK YOU . IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS THE CHARTER REVIEW BOARD AT THE BEGINNING OF THE MEETING SO THAT YOU DO NOT NEED TO STAY UNTIL THE END, WHEN WE WILL HAVE PUBLIC COMMENT FOR ANYONE WHO HAS NOT YET SPOKEN? >> DENISE LANE: I AM HERE TO SPEAK BECAUSE I WANT TO LEAVE BECAUSE I HAVE TO LEAVE FOR ANOTHER 7 O'CLOCK MEETING . MY NAME IS DENISE LANE . I WANT TO APOLOGIZE FOR MY APPEARANCE TONIGHT . I HAD TO RUN INTERFERENCE FOR RESIDENTS AND SWFWMD FOLKS . I DIDN'T NEED TO BE IN HEELS RUNNING AROUND IN THE TREES . I APOLOGIZE . I CAME STRAIGHT FROM THERE . THERE ARE A FEW ISSUES I WANT TO THROW OUT AT YOU AND GET INTO DELIBERATION LATER ON DURING THIS ENTIRE PROCESS . I AM A COMMUNITY LEADER, PRESIDENT OF THE LUTZ CIVIC ASSOCIATION . I ALSO FOUNDED AN ORGANIZATION CALLED HC-3, WHICH IS HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY CONFERENCE OF COMMUNITIES . IT IS MADE UP OF LEADERSHIP IN THIS CITY AND COUNTY, IN HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY, OF UMBRELLA LEADERS WHO REPRESENT MANY, MANY EITHER HOMEOWNERS OR OTHER CIVIC ASSOCIATIONS . CONSEQUENTLY, WITH 30 MEMBERS, WE REPRESENT OVER 150,000 RESIDENTS IN HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY . WE CAN GET THE WORD FOR 150,000 RESIDENTS . I ALSO AM A MEMBER OF SIERRA CLUB AND A SPOKESPERSON FOR SIERRA CLUB, CO-CHAIR AND ALSO A MEMBER OF THE LEAGUE OF WOMEN VOTERS . I DO BELIEVE IN GOOD GOVERNMENT AND OBVIOUSLY YOU ARE HERE FOR THAT PURPOSE TOO, TO HAVE GOOD GOVERNMENT IN THIS COUNTY . FIRST OF ALL, I WOULD LIKE TO URGE YOU TO LOOK AT NON-PARTISAN COUNTY COMMISSION . THE PARTISANSHIP THAT WE HAVE HAD, I THINK, IS NOT THE PROBLEM, BUT IS A PROBLEM THAT HAS SURFACED ITSELF QUITE OFTEN IN THE LAST FEW YEARS, TOO OBVIOUSLY QUITE OFTEN . I THINK WITH NON-PARTISANSHIP, YOU ARE GOING TO BRING A DIFFERENT ATTITUDE TO THE COMMISSION . I ALSO THINK IT'S GOING TO HELP WITH SOME CAMPAIGN REFORM AND CONTRIBUTION REFORM . SECONDLY, I AGREE WITH THE FACT -- AND I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY OUR BOCC IS THE ONLY GOVERNMENT BOARD THAT DOES NOT HAVE ITS OWN ATTORNEYS FOR THE BOARD . HARTLINE HAS IT -- I MEAN ALL OF THEM HAVE THEIR OWN ATTORNEY . MOST BOARDS HAVE THEIR OWN ATTORNEYS . WE HAVE CREATED A HORRIBLE SITUATION FOR OUR COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE BY HAVING TO DECIDE WHAT'S IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE COUNTY VERSUS WHAT'S IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE BOARD, AND THEY DO CONFLICT . MORE OFTEN THAN YOU REALIZE AND MORE OFTEN THAN I THINK PEOPLE WANT TO REALIZE . SO I WOULD URGE YOU TO PLEASE LOOK AT HAVING A BOARD ATTORNEY OR ATTORNEYS -- WE DON'T NEED TO INCREASE THE COUNTY ATTORNEY STAFF, MAYBE MOVE SOME OF THAT STAFF OVER TO THE BOARD STAFF . THIRD, I WOULD LIKE YOU TO PLEASE LOOK AT SUPERMAJORITY VOTES ON FEES AND TAXES . SOME OF THOSE RIGHT NOW IT ONLY TAKES A MAJORITY . I THINK SUPERMAJORITY WHEN WE ARE PLAYING WITH CITIZEN TAXES AND FEES AND THINGS THAT ARE IMPORTANT TO THIS COUNTY ARE VERY IMPORTANT . I ALSO WANT YOU TO DEFINITELY LOOK AT OUR FORM OF GOVERNMENT . AND THE QUESTION I POSE TO YOU, WHICH YOU NEED TO ASK YOURSELF BEFORE YOU DO ANYTHING WITH THE FORM OF OUR GOVERNMENT, IS THE CURRENT FORM OF GOVERNMENT THAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW BROKEN? OR IS IT THE PEOPLE WITHIN THAT FORM OF GOVERNMENT THAT ARE NOT WORKING WELL? IF IT IS THE GOVERNMENT THAT'S BROKEN, THEN YES, WE NEED TO LOOK AT EITHER FIXING THIS FORM OF GOVERNMENT OR CHANGING IT . IF IT'S THE PEOPLE, WE NEED TO ELECT GOOD PEOPLE, BUT YOU NEED TO ASK THAT QUESTION FIRST: IS IT THE PEOPLE OR THE FORM? THROUGH HC-3, I'M GOING TO BE PUTTING ON A FORUM THAT BASICALLY IS GOING TO GIVE YOU PROS AND CONS OF COUNTY MAYOR VERSUS AN ELECTED CHAIR VERSUS FIXING THE FORM OF GOVERNMENT THAT WE HAVE . IT WILL BE PUBLICLY NOTICED AND I WOULD LIKE TO INVITE THIS ENTIRE BOARD IF YOU WOULD LIKE . I DO BELIEVE IT WILL BE TELEVISED, SO YOU CAN WATCH IT IF YOU DON'T WANT TO ATTEND . BUT IT IS A WAY YOU CAN LISTEN TO THE PROS AND CONS . THIS WILL BE AN HOUR AND A HALF OF QUESTION AND ANSWER . I WILL LET YOU KNOW . IT SHOULD BE IN THE NEXT TWO MONTHS . LAST BUT NOT LEAST, WHEN I LEFT THE LAST MEETING, I WATCHED YOU ON TV, AND ONE OF THE ISSUES BROUGHT UP WAS HAVING A NIGHT FOR CITIZEN LEADERSHIP TO COME AND ADDRESS YOU . PLEASE DON'T CONFUSE CITIZEN LEADERSHIP AS A SPECIAL INTEREST . WE'RE NOT . WE DON'T GET PAID . WE DO THIS OUT OF THE KINDNESS AND LOVE OF OUR HEART FOR OUR COMMUNITIES . WE ARE TAXPAYERS . DON'T START LUMPING US TOGETHER, THIS AND THAT INTEREST, AND EVERYBODY WILL SHOW UP . WE ARE ALL URGED TO COME TO MEETINGS . HAVE ONE MEETING THAT ALLOWS CITIZENS, BY PURE INVITATION, YOU WILL GET SOME LEADERSHIP AND THAT WILL PROBABLY GET SOME LEADERSHIP THAT YOU MIGHT NOT OTHERWISE GET . THANK YOU. >> JAN SMITH: THANK YOU . IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS THE CHARTER REVIEW BOARD AT THIS TIME? SEEING NO ONE ELSE APPROACH THE PODIUM, I DO WANT TO TELL THE BOARD THAT WE HAVE TWO GUESTS THIS EVENING AND I'M SURE MOST OF YOU HAVE ALREADY SEEN THAT -- OUR TAX COLLECTOR, MR. DOUG BELDEN, IS HERE, AND FROM THE COUNTY, ASSISTANT COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR, MANAGEMENT, ASSISTANT FOR HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY, TOM ZECKER. WHAT THEY WILL DO IS GIVE YOU A BRIEF DESCRIPTION OF WHAT THEY DO, HOW THEY DO IT AND YOU WILL BE ABLE TO ASK . YOU WILL HAVE A QUESTION AND ANSWER FOR EACH SPEAKER . I WOULD LIKE TO INTRODUCE TO YOU MR. DOUG BELDEN, HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY'S TAX COLLECTOR . THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE . I APOLOGIZE FOR THE DELAY IN OUR START . >> DOUG BELDEN: THANK YOU . I APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO APPEAR BEFORE THIS BOARD . FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO DON'T KNOW, I WANT TO GO OVER THE PRIMARY FUNCTIONS IN OUR OFFERS . AS TAX COLLECTOR, WE ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR ADDRESSING AND ACCEPTING AD VALOREM TAXES, DRIVER'S LICENSE, TITLE, REGISTRATIONS . WE ISSUE OCCUPATIONAL LICENSE, HUNTING, FISHING LICENSES ^ (MISSING FIVE MINUTES, TECHNICAL DIFFICULTY) >>JAN SMITH: DO YOU HAVE IDEAS ON WHAT SOLUTIONS YOU CAN SHARE WITH US? >> DOUG BELDEN: I HAVE NOT FOCUSED ON THE PARTICULAR ISSUES THAT THIS CHARTER BOARD IS REVIEW, OTHER THAN WHAT THE FOLKS HAVE PERFORMED IN OUR OFFICE. >> I THINK IT IS WIDE OPEN RIGHT NOW. >>DOUG: I HAVE HEARD DIFFERENT TOPICS. FOR EXAMPLE, THE COUNTY MAYOR, WHICH I THINK YOU CAN ARGUE POSITIONS BOTH WAYS, OR THE PARTISAN VERSUS NOT PARTISAN. I BELIEVE -- PERSONALLY, THIS IS ME SPEAKING -- I BELIEVE IN HAVING NON-PARTISAN. I BELIEVE IT IDENTIFIES THE PERSON BASED ON THE POLITICAL IDEOLOGY, THE WAY THAT PERSON FEELS. I THINK THE PERSON SHOULD KNOW ABOUT THAT PERSON BASED ON THEIR PARTY. THIS IS MY PERSONAL BELIEF. AS FAR AS THE COUNTY MAYOR, I DON'T THINK IT IS THE POSITION. I THINK IT IS THE PERSON. I WILL TELL YOU NOW THERE ARE CERTAIN PEOPLE THAT INTENDS TO HAVE COUNTY MAYOR. WE HAVE SLEEPLESS NIGHTS ON CERTAIN PEOPLE. BUT CERTAIN PEOPLE WOULD BE EXCELLENT, WITH THAT AMOUNT OF POWER. THAT IS JUST MY GUT FEELING ON THAT. I DON'T KNOW. I HAVEN'T SPENT A GREAT DEAL OF TIME ADDRESSING SOME OF THE ISSUES THIS PARTICULAR BOARD HAS BEEN DISCUSSING REGARDING THE CHARTER. I THINK A LOT OF IT SHOULD REMAIN THE SAME. >>ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT TIES INTO YOUR PARTICULAR AREA OF COLLECTING MONEY AND DOING THE CHECKS AND BALANCES THAT HAS BEEN TAKEN OUT, WE HAVE CENTERED ON IT, IT CAME UP IN PUBLIC COMMENT ON OUR LAST MEETING, IS THE SUBJECT OF A COUNTY AUDITOR, A NEW POSITION. HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT A NEW POSITION LIKE THAT BEING COLLECTED? >> I BELIEVE RICHARD AKE CONDUCTS NOW THE FINANCIAL AUDITS AND COMPLIANCE AUDITS. RIGHT NOW THE AUDITS ARE SUBBED OUT. WE CAME OUT PERFECT. I'M WIDE OPEN TO ANY SUGGESTIONS. I DON'T CARE WHO AUDITS MY OFFICE. I'M A REAL BIG BELIEVER IN PERFORMANCE. I AM ELECTED BY THE FOLKS TO PROVIDE A SERVICE TO THEM AND I SHOULD BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE FOR THAT, AS THE CONSTITUTIONAL, SO SHOULD EVERY OTHER CONSTITUTIONAL. >> MR. BALLARD: A QUESTION ON THE BUDGET THERE. I ALSO HEARD YOU, (OFF MIC). I CONCUR WITH YOU THAT IT SHOULD BE LEFT ALONE, BECAUSE YOU ARE ACCOUNTABLE TO THE VOTERS. ON YOUR BUDGET, I HEARD YOU SAY IT WAS APPROVED BY THE DEPARTMENT OF REVENUE? >> DOUG BELDEN: CORRECT. >> MR. BALLARD: I'M ASSUMING IT'S ALL A FEE-TYPE OPERATION THAT YOU GET FEES TO OPERATE. >> DOUG: YES, SIR. >> MR. BALLARD: DO YOU GET ANY COUNTY MONEY IN ANY WAY? >> DOUG: I AM CALLED A FEE-BASED TAX COLLECTOR, WHICH MEANS I RETAIN TWO PERCENT OF WHAT I COLLECT. WHATEVER EXCESS FEES -- 6 MILLION DOLLARS A YEAR, WHICH MEANS THE MORE MONEY I CUT FROM MY BUDGETT MORE MONEY I GET BACK FROM THE BOCC. ANY KIND OF AMENDMENTS TO THAT BUDGET MUST BE APPROVED BY THE DEPARTMENT OF REVENUE. THE. >> MR. BALLARD: THE OTHER THING IS THE PUBLIC DOESN'T SEE YOUR BUDGET, LIKE THE INCOME AND THE COMPETENCES AND SO FORTH. I THINK THAT'S WHAT MR. WHITE WAS SAYING, HE'D JUST LIKE A LITTLE HANDOUT OR SOMETHING WHEN THEY COME IN THERE OR SOMETHING. >> DOUG: ANYBODY WHO REQUESTS A COPY OF MY BUDGET IS WELCOME TO IT IN MY OFFICE. >> MR. BALLARD: I HAVE NEVER SEEN ONE, BUT I KNOW YOUR OFFICE IS OPERATED VERY EFFICIENTLY. I KNOW I USE IT IN PLANT CITY AND I SEE A CERTAIN IMPROVEMENT IN ASSISTANCE WHEN YOU GO IN THERE. >> DOUG: THANK YOU. >> I HAVE NO QUESTIONS. >> DOES THE MONEY GO BACK TO THE GENERAL FUND, WHEN IT IS RETURNED TO THE COUNTY? >> YES, IT DOES. >> JAN SMITH: ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OF MR. BELDEN? WE APPRECIATE YOUR TAKING THE TIME TO COME THIS EVENING. MR. HUNZEKER IS HERE THIS EVENING, WITH A BIT OF A STIFF NECK, SO PLEASE DON'T MAKE HIM TURN HIS NECK. HE INSISTED ON WEARING A TIE. WELCOME, MR. HUNZEKER, THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE. >> MR. HUNZEKER: THANK YOU FOR INVITING ME. MY SURGEON WANTED TO GET A POUND OF FLESH OUT OF ME AND HE GOT IT. THIS IS THE FIRST TIME I HAVE ATTEMPTED TO PUT A SHIRT AND TIE ON IT AND IT IS A LITTLE UNCOMFORTABLE MOVING AROUND. GOOD EVENING, THANK YOU FOR INVITING ME. I BELIEVE I AM HERE FOR THE PURPOSE OF DISCUSSING WITH YOU THE BUDGET PROCESS AND HOW IT WORKS IN HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY. YOU HAD SOME DELIBERATIONS ON THAT ISSUE AT YOUR LAST MEETING. IF I CAN HELP IN THE PROCESS, I HOPE I CAN HELP. LET ME START BY EXPLAINING TO YOU THE CONTEXT IN WHICH THE BUDGET IS ADOPTED AND THE FRAMEWORK THAT IT WORKS WITHIN. WE HAVE STATUTORY CONTROL OVER COUNTY GOVERNMENTS AND HOW THEY DEAL WITH THEIR GOVERNMENT, STATUTORY, NOT CHARTER. THE STATUTES IDENTIFY WHEN THEY DELIVER THE BUDGET, WHEN WE HAVE TO ADOPT TENTATIVE MILLAGE RATES, WHEN THE FINAL MILLAGE RATE HAS TO BE ADOPTED. ERIC HAS A SCHEDULE THAT HE CAN GIVE YOU. IT COMPARES THE BUDGET PROCESS WITH THAT REQUIRED BY STATUTE. LET ME RUN THROUGH THAT FOR YOU. ON THE FIRST OF JUNE, THE PROPERTY APPRAISER IS REQUIRED TO GIVE US, THAT PREPARE THE BUDGET FOR BOARD, A TENTATIVE VALUE OF THE MILLAGE. AT THAT SAME DATE, SOME CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS, THAT'S THE DATE THEY ARE REQUIRED BY STATUTE TO DELIVER THEIR BUDGET TO US. THEN WE GET, ON JULY 1ST, THE ACTUAL TAX REVENUE THAT IS ANTICIPATED FROM THE MILLAGE RATES THAT WE HAVE ESTABLISHED IN THE PRIOR YEAR. AND THEN ON JULY 15TH, ACCORDING TO THE STATUTES, THAT'S WHEN THE BUDGET IS TO BE DELIVERED TO THE BOARD. MAYBE THE CONTEXT OF THIS AGAIN IS, THIS IS A 2.2 BILLION DOLLARS BUDGET, BUT THAT IS REALLY FICTITIOUS A LITTLE BIT AND I WILL COME BACK TO THAT. THEN IN THE FIRST WEEK IN AUGUST, THE BOARD HAS TO SET THE TENTATIVE MILLAGE RATES. THAT DOESN'T GIVE THEM MUCH TIME TO DEAL WITH A SIZE OF BUDGET LIKE THIS. MAY HAVE WORKED A HUNDRED YEARS AGO WHEN WE HAD A BUDGET OF A COUPLE THOUSAND DOLLARS. THEN IN SEPTEMBER THERE IS A REQUIREMENT STATUTORILY FOR 2 PUBLIC HEARINGS AND THE BUDGET IS ADOPTED AT THE SECOND PUBLIC HEARING AND THE BUDGET YEAR BEGINS OCTOBER 1. WE HAVE, IN THE LAST SEVERAL YEARS, GONE TO THE BOARD WITH A BUDGET ON A SCHEDULE OF JUNE 1ST. WE GIVE THEM THE OPPORTUNITY TO REVIEW THE BUDGET THROUGH JUNE, JULY, AUGUST, AND THROUGH THE PUBLIC HEARING IN SEPTEMBER. AS I SAID, THERE IS A REQUIREMENT FOR TWO PUBLIC HEARINGS, BY STATUTE, IN SEPTEMBER. WE BELIEVE THE PUBLIC MIGHT WANT TO HAVE THEIR VOICES HEARD EARLIER IN THE PROCESS BEFORE THE BUDGET IS FINALIZED, SO WE HAVE SCHEDULED AN ADDITIONAL TWO PUBLIC HEARINGS IN THE MONTH OF JUNE THAT GIVES THE PUBLIC THE OPPORTUNITY TO COME IN AND TALK ABOUT THE PROCESS, WHAT THEY WOULD LIKE IN, WHAT THEY WOULD LIKE OUT WHAT, THEY WOULD LIKE MORE EMPHASIS ON, WHAT THEY WOULD LIKE LESS EMPHASIS ON, AND THEY DO THAT IN JUNE, AND THEN WE CONTINUE OUR DELIBERATIONS WITH THE BOARD IN ANY NUMBER OF WORKSHOPS THROUGH THE SUMMER, UNTIL THEY GET COMFORTABLE WITH SEND SETTING THAT TENTATIVE MILLAGE RATE REQUIRED BY STATUTE FIRST WEEK IN AUGUST. WHEN THAT IS SET THE FIRST WEEK IN AUGUST, THAT SETS THE UPPER LIMIT OF WHAT TAXES AND TAX RATES CAN BE, WHEN THE BOARD FINALLY ADOPT IT IS BUDGET IN SEPTEMBER. THE MILLAGE RATES CAN'T BE ANY HIGHER IN SEPTEMBER THAN THOSE ADOPTED AT THAT TENTATIVE RATE MILLAGE POINT IN EARLY AUGUST. THEY CAN BE LOWER BUT NOT HIGHER. SO AS YOU SEE, THE STATUTES CONTROL THE MINIMUM TIME FRAMES FOR THE BUDGET. WE HAVE CHOSEN TO ADD AN ADDITIONAL 45 DAYS TO THAT PROCESS. LET ME ALSO TELL THAT YOU IF THE BOARD WANTED TO START THE BUDGET IN JANUARY, THEY CAN DO THAT. ALL THEY HAVE TO DO IS TELL US, AND WE WILL START THE BUDGET. IT'S NOT SOMETHING YOU WOULD NECESSARILY HAVE TO BE INVOLVED WITH, BECAUSE IN READING THE COUNTY CHARTER, THERE IS VERY LITTLE, IF ANYTHING, MENTION BESIDE THE BUDGET PROCESS. IT IS SOMETHING WE DO FOR THEM. LET ME GIVE A LITTLE EXPLANATION FOR THAT. WE WORK FOR THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS. ONE WAY TO LOOK AT THAT IS FROM A LEGISLATIVE STANDPOINT, IF YOU HAVE A LEGISLATIVE COMMITTEE AND THEY APPOINT A STAFF PERSON TO MANAGE THEIR AFFAIRS, THAT'S THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR AND THE SITUATION OF DELIVERING THE BUDGET. WE'LL DO WHATEVER THE COMMITTEE WANTS TO BE DONE. WE ARE NOT A SEPARATION OF POWERS GOVERNMENT FROM A GOVERNANCE STANDPOINT THAT YOU WILL BE INVOLVED IN. WE ARE ONE UNIT AND WE WORKED FOR THAT LEGISLATIVE BLANCH AND WE CAN PROVIDE THEM ANY INFORMATION THAT THEY ASK US TO PROVIDE. IN TERMS OF THE BUDGET, WE CAN CHANGE THE SCHEDULE AND WE CAN CHANGE THE POST AT ANY TIME THE BOARD WANTS US TO CHANGE THAT PROCESS, BECAUSE IT IS THEY THAT DIRECT HOW THE BUDGET IS PREPARED, WHEN IT IS PREPARED, AND WHAT IT IS THEY WILL SEE AND WHEN THEY WILL SEE IT. I THOUGHT I WOULD GIVE YOU A LITTLE BACKGROUND ON THE BUDGET. THAT'S THE WAY IT WORKS IN HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY. WE CAN CHANGE IT AT ANY POINT IN TIME, BUT FOR THOSE LEGISLATIVE MANDATES, MINIMUM DATES AND MINIMUM REQUIREMENTS, A BETTER OUTLINE IN THAT SCHEDULE PROVIDED TO YOU BY ERIC JOHNSON. >> MR. HUNZEKER, YOU WERE GOING TO DISCUSS WHAT PART OF THE BUDGET COMES UNDER COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR AND WHAT PARTS OF THE BUDGET COME UNDER OTHER AUTHORITIES AND CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICES. >>MR. HUNZEKER: I CAN DO THAT. LET ME DISPEL A LITTLE MYSTERY ABOUT THIS BUDGET. WE PUBLISH THE BUDGET, YOU HAVE HEARD $2.2 MILLION BUDGET, $2.3 MILLION BUDGET. THAT IS MISLEADING. PEOPLE GO TO THE BOTTOM LINE. THE WAY WE PRODUCE THE BUDGET IS SPECIFICALLY LAID OUT IN STATUTE, PAGE, PARAGRAPH. EVEN THE ADVERTISEMENT FOR THE PUBLIC HEARINGS WE HAVE IN SEPTEMBER. EVERY WORD, EVERY PERIOD, EVERY COMMA THAT GOES IN THAT ADVERTISEMENT IN THE NEWSPAPER IS MANDATED BY LEGISLATION. WE CAN'T PUT OUT ANY ADVERTISEMENT. WE HAVE TO FOLLOW RULES AND THEY HAVE A PRETTY BIG STICK -- CUTTING OFF STATE-REVENUE SHARING -- TO ANY COUNTY GOVERNMENT THAT DOESN'T FOLLOW THEIR PROCESS. SO WE FOLLOW IT TO THE LETTER OF THE LAW AND THEY REVIEW OUR ADVERTISINGS AND BUDGETS EVERY YEAR. WE HAVE TO SEND A COPY OF THE ADVERTISING TO THEM SO THEY MAKE SURE WE HAVEN'T VIOLATED STATUTORY WORDING. THAT MAKES US ACCOUNT FOR EVERY DOLLAR IN THE BUDGET. SOMETIMES WE ACCOUNT FOR IT TWO TIMES. THAT'S HOW WE GET TO 2.2 BILLION-DOLLAR. WE BRING IN, IN THE WAY OF REVENUE, A LITTLE OVER A BILLION DOLLARS A YEAR. THE EXAMPLE I WOULD GIVE YOU, IF YOU HAD YOUR AUNT MARTHA WHO PASSED AWAY AND LEFT YOU $500,000 AND YOU HAD A BUDGET FROM YOUR PERSONAL JOB AND YOUR JOB PAYS YOU $50,000 A YEAR, DO YOU TELL PEOPLE YOU HAVE A BUDGET OF $500,000? NO. BECAUSE IT IS IN A SAVINGS ACCOUNT SOMEWHERE. WE HAVE TO ACCOUNT FOR OUR SAVINGS ACCOUNT EVERY YEAR. MOST OF OUR SAVINGS ACCOUNTS ARE IN BONDS INDENTURES, AND WE COUNT THAT EVERY YEAR. WE ALSO COUNT IF MONEY COMES INTO ONE FUND AND WE MOVE IT TO ANOTHER FUND, THE STATE REQUIRES US TO COUNT IT AGAIN. THAT IS ALMOST A HALF A BILLION DOLLARS. SO A DOLLAR THAT COMES IN ONE FUND, IT'S COUNTED AS REVENUE THERE, IT MOVES TO ANOTHER FUND, TO TRACK EXPENSES OF IT, WHEN WE MOVE IT, WE COUNT IT THE SECOND TIME. SO THAT'S HOW YOU GET TO $2.3 BILL. IT'S A FICTITIOUS NUMBER. THE REAL THING IS WE HAVE A BUDGET OF, OPERATING, 900 MILLION DOLLARS. CAPITAL BUDGET OF 400 MILLION. WE HAVE A DEBT SERVICE BUDGET OF A COUPLE HUNDRED MILLION DOLLARS BUT THE 2.3 BILLION-DOLLAR NUMBER IS A LITTLE MISLEADING. NOW THAT PART RELATES TO THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR. YOU HAVE ALL HEARD THE ADAGE LIKE FIGURES DON'T LIE, LIARS FIGURE. NO MATTER HOW YOU SLICE AND DICE THIS, YOU CAN COME UP WITH AN ANSWER YOU WOULD LIKE. FROM MY STANDPOINT, I CAN CUT THIS BUDGET IN A COUPLE DIFFERENT WAYS. IF YOU TAKE THE TOTAL OPERATING BUDGET FOR HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY, INCLUDING THOSE OPERATIONS INCLUDING THE FEE-BASED OPERATIONS, THE WATER AND SEWER SYSTEM, ALL GENERATED AND MANAGED BY FEES, IT HAS A SEPARATE SET OF BOOKS, IT CAN LIVE AND DIE ON THE REVENUE IT GENERATES TO PAY ITS DEBT SERVICE AND CAPITAL EXPENDITURE, NO GOVERNMENT EXPENDITURES THAT GO INTO THAT OPERATION. YOU INCLUDE THE SOLID WASTE SYSTEM, IT'S MADE UP THE SAME WAY, LIVES AND DIES ON THE REVENUES IT EARNS, OR ITS DEBT SERVICES AND CAPITAL EXPENDITURES. WE CALL THOSE ENTERPRISE OPERATIONS, THE CLOSEST THING TO WHAT YOU IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR HAVE AS A BUSINESS ENTITY. THEY ARE SEPARATE AND DISTINCT SETS OF BOOKS. BUT IF YOU INCLUDE THAT WITH THE GENERAL GOVERNMENT EXPENSE, YOU HAVE A TOTAL OPERATING BUDGET OF A LITTLE LESS THAN A BILLION DOLLARS. THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR HAS 594 MILLION DOLLARS WORTH OF RESPONSIBILITY IF YOU ADD UP THE BUDGETS HE IS RESPONSIBLE FOR. THAT IS ABOUT 55 PERCENT OF THE BUDGET. IF YOU TOOK THOSE FEE-BASED OPERATIONS OUT, THE WATER AND SEWER SYSTEM, THE SOLID WASTE SYSTEM, AND LOOKED AT GENERAL GOVERNMENT EXPENSES AND GENERAL FUND THAT WE HAVE FOR THE COUNTY-WIDE EXPENSES AND WE HAVE A SEPARATE GENERAL FUND FOR MANAGING THOSE SERVICES IN THE UNINCORPORATED AREA OF THE COUNTY, THOSE ARE TWO GENERAL GOVERNMENT FUND, YOU ADD THOSE TOGETHER, AND YOU TAKE THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR'S PORTION OF THAT, THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR CAN RANGE -- AGAIN, DEPENDING ON HOW YOU SLICE AND DICE I, 28 TO 38 PERCENT OF THE TOTAL BUDGET OF THE GENERAL GOVERNMENT SERVICES. THE OTHER AREAS OF RESPONSIBILITY OF THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR HAVE A BELT FOR THEIR BUDGETS AND THOSE WOULD INCLUDE THE CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS AND SOME BOARDS, COMMISSIONS AND AGENCIES WITHIN HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY, WILL HAVE THE RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE BALANCE OF THOSE FUNDS. SO THAT'S HOW YOU CAN LOOK AT THE BUDGET FROM A CONTROL STANDPOINT, AND WHO HAS THE RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE MAJORITY OF THOSE DOLLARS. THE CHAIR ASKED ME IF I WOULD PREPARE SOME INFORMATION ON THAT AND SO I GIVE YOU THAT FOR YOUR DELIBERATIONS AND CONSIDERATIONS. IF THAT ANSWERS THAT QUESTION, I WOULD BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ABOUT THE BUDGET OR ANYTHING ELSE. >> MR. HURLEY? >> MR. HURLEY: I FEEL A LOT BETTER NOW KNOWING WE ONLY HAVE A BILLION-DOLLAR BUDGET AND NOT A $2.3 BILLION-DOLLAR BUDGET. TWO QUESTIONS. ONE, THE OPERATING BUDGET, IS THAT INCLUDING THE FEES AND THINGS COLLECTED BY THE CONSTITUTION ALWAYS AND THOSE OUTSIDE THINGS? >> MR. HUNZEKER: YES, SIR. THAT'S IN THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS' ADOPTED BUDGET. SOME OF THE CONSTITUTIONALS HAVE FEE BUDGETS (CONSTITUTIONALS). AND PART OF THE EXPENSES AND THEIR OPERATION ARE FUNDED FROM THOSE FEE BUDGETS. THOSE AREN'T INCLUDED. >> MR. BALLARD: OKAY. WHAT OTHER AREAS -- LIKE IN VOLUSIA COUNTY, WE HAVE A SUMMARY OF THE CHARTERS BEFORE THE OTHER COUNTIES. VOLUSIA COUNTY, THEY HAVE NO CONSTITUTIONALS. HOW DOES THAT WORK FOR THEIR BUDGET AND ARE THERE ECONOMIES OF SCALE THAT CAN BE APPLIED FOR THAT, FOR HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY? >>MR. HUNZEKER: I AM AWARE THAT VOLUSIA DOESN'T HAVE CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS AS WE KNOW THEM. I'M NOT SURE EXACTLY HOW THAT WORKS IN VOLUSIA. I HAVE HEARD THAT SOME COUNTIES HAVE INDEPENDENTLY ELECTED DEPARTMENT DIRECTORS AND THEIR BUDGETS ARE ALL PART OF THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS BUT THEY STILL ELECT THEM INDEPENDENTLY. I'M NOT SO SURE HOW VOLUSIA DOES THAT. THE SECOND PART OF YOUR QUESTION, RELATING TO ECONOMIES OF SCALE, YOU LOOK AT TWO PARTS OF THE QUESTION. EFFICIENCY AND EFFECTIVENESS. THERE HAVEN'T BEEN STUDIES LOCALLY. TAXWATCH MADE SOME REFERENCE TO THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS AND THAT THINGS SHOULD BE STUDIED. IF YOU CONSOLIDATED ALL THE CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS ON THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS, WOULD THERE BE SOME EFFICIENCIES? THERE ARE NO STUDIES THERE. I WOULD SUSPECT -- I KNOW WE HAVE HAD DISCUSSIONS IN THAT AREA -- OVER THE YEARS, THE RESPONSES HAVE RANGED FROM "WE DON'T -- DON'T HAVE DUPLICATION OF EFFORT) BUT IF YOU CONSOLIDATED ALL THE FUNCTIONS UNDER THE CONSTITUTIONAL GOVERNMENT, THERE MIGHT BE SOME ECONOMY IN SCALE. BUT TO COME BACK, IS IT AS EFFECTIVE AS THE FOCUS WE HAVE ON THE CONSTITUTIONALS TO MANAGE THEIR FINANCIAL AFFAIRS AND PROCUREMENTS AND DATA SYSTEMS AS MENTIONED BY THE TAX COLLECTOR? I IMAGINE THAT DEBATE COULD GO ON, LONG AND HARD. ECONOMIES OF SCALE IS CERTAINLY SOMETHING THAT YOU MIGHT WANT TO TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION. THE OTHER SIDE IS WOULD THE SERVICE STILL BE AS GOOD AS THE CONSTITUTIONAL IF ALL THAT WERE TO BE CONSOLIDATED? I SUSPECT YOU COULD GET TO A SAVINGS, AND WHETHER IT WOULD BE WORTH THE EFFORT IS ANOTHER THING TO CONSIDER. >> MR. BALLARD? MR. BALLARD: YES, WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO ASK YOU IS, ON THE AUDITING, DOES THE COUNTY HAVE IN-HOUSE AUDITORS OR DOES THE CLERK OF THE CIRCUIT COURT DO THAT OR DO Y'ALL HIRE AUDITORS TO DO THAT, TO DO THE AUDIT FUNCTION PRESENTLY? >> THERE ARE DIFFERENT KINDS OF AUDITS. WE HAVE THE FINANCIAL AUDIT, AND THE ADMINISTRATION IS INVOLVED IN RETAINING THE SERVICES OF (^ NAME). UNDER THIS FORM OF GOVERNMENT, THE CHIEF OF THE CLERK, HAS RESPONSIBILITIES. WHEN UNSPENT DOLLARS GO BACK TO THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS, WHERE THEY REALLY GO BACK IS TO THE CLERK OF THE CIRCUIT COURT WHO IS THE ACCOUNTANT FOR THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS. WE ARE INVOLVED IN THE ADMINISTRATION STANDPOINT TO RETAIN THE AUDITORS WHO WILL DO THE AUDIT OF THE BOOKS OF THE CLERK OF THE CIRCUIT COURT AND EACH OF THE OFFICERS OF THE FINANCIAL AFFAIRS AND PRODUCING ONE AUDIT REPORT EVENTUALLY FOR THE PUBLIC'S REVIEW. AND SO WE RETAIN THAT FINANCIAL ALL AUDITOR. ON THE OTHER HAND, THERE IS COMPLIANCE AUDITS, AND RICHARD AKE, AS CLERK OF THE COURT, ALSO WEARS THE HAT OF BEING AUDITOR FOR HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY. SO IF HE AUDITS DEPARTMENTS WITHIN THE ADMINISTRATION FOR COMPLIANCE WITH STATUTORY REQUIREMENTS AND GRANTS, AWARDS, AND PROVIDES THOSE REPORTS TO THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS. THEN WE HAVE -- I GUESS YOU WOULD PUT IT UNDER THE HEADING OF COMPLIANCE AUDITS. THEN WE HAVE PERFORMANCE AUDIT THAT IS THE BOARD IS INVOLVED IN RETAINING THE SERVICES OF INDEPENDENT OUTSIDE FIRMS TO COME IN AND AUDIT THE DEPARTMENTS WITHIN THE ADMINISTRATION FOR THIS THING CALLED PERFORMANCE, TO SEE IF THEY ARE PERFORMING EFFICIENTLY AND EFFECTIVELY, SO THERE ARE THREE DIFFERENT KINDS OF AUDITS PROVIDED BY THREE DIFFERENT AUDIT FIRMS. >> OKAY, THANK YOU. >> MR. WHITE? >> MR. WHITE: MS. FRANK WAS HERE LAST MEETING AND SHE TALKED ABOUT, I GUESS, A PARALLEL STRUCTURE EXAMINING THE BUDGET. IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA, ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY COUNTY THAT HAS SUCH A SYSTEM SET UP? >> MR. HUNZEKER: I'M NOT AWARE OF ANY, BUT I HAVE NOT GONE LOOKING FOR ANY EITHER. SO DON'T TAKE MY WORD FOR IT. I THINK YOU COULD RESEARCH THAT. AS I SAID, WE WORK FOR THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS. WE PROVIDE THEM THEIR INFORMATION TO HELP THEM MAKE DECISION. EVERYTHING THAT WE LOOK AT IN DEVELOPING A BUDGET FOR THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS, WE GIVE THAT TO THEM. THEY SEE THE SAME THING THAT WE SEE WHEN WE ARE DEVELOPING THE BUDGET FOR THEIR REVIEW. THEY GET THE SAME DOCUMENTS THAT WE ARE PROVIDED. NOW, GIVEN THE SIZE OF THE COUNTY AND THE NUMBER OF ORGANIZATION THAT IS THE BOARD FUNDS, IT'S A LOT OF INFORMATION, BUT THAT'S WHY WE START EARLIER THAN WE ARE REQUIRED TO START, SO THEY CAN HAVE PLEASANT OF TIME TO DELIBERATED THOSE ISSUES AND FOCUS ON THOSE ISSUES THAT THEY WANT. BUT IT'S ALL THERE. I DON'T KNOW IF HAVING TWO BUDGET OFFICES WOULD HELP THE PROCESS AT ALL. YOU HAVE ONE BUDGET OFFICE THAT SAYS MARCH TO THE LEFT, ONE THAT SAYS MARCH TO THE RIGHT, I'M NOT SURE HOW WELL YOU ARE SERVED BY THAT. AS I SAID, IT'S NOT LIKE THAT WE ARE A DIFFERENT BRANCH OF GOVERNMENT INDEPENDENT FROM THE BOARD. WE ARE THERE TO HELP THEM DEVELOP A BUDGET THAT THEY ARE GOING TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE FOR TO THE VOTERS AND WE TRY TO DO THE BEST WE CAN WITH THE GUIDANCE THEY GIVE US, AND IF THEY WANT US TO CHANGE IT, ALL THEY HAVE TO DO IS TELL US. >> CRB: THE SEVEN WORKSHOPS THAT YOU HAVE, THAT'S WHEN THE COUNTY COMMISSIONERS INTERACT WITH THE STAFF. ARE THEY SATISFIED? THEY INDICATE TO ME -- IT SEEMS AS THOUGH SHE'S INDICATING THAT THE RESULT OF THE BUDGETS, SHE'S NOT SATISFIED, BECAUSE SHE DIDN'T GET A CHANCE TO ASK THE PEOPLE YOU ARE ASKING THESE QUESTIONS, THAT YOU COME UP WITH TO ACCUMULATE YOUR BUDGET. IS THERE SOMETHING NOT TAKING PLACE IN THESE WORKSHOPS TO SATISFY THE CURIOSITY OF THE COMMISSIONER? >> MR. HUNZEKER: MAYBE THE COMMISSIONER COULD ANSWER THAT QUESTION. I BELIEVE THAT WE GO THROUGH THE PROCESS WITH THE BOARD ABOUT HOW WE ARE GOING TO DEAL WITH THE BUDGET. WE HAVE THIS FLAGGING PROCESS WHERE THE COMMISSIONERS, IF THEY WANT TO ADDRESS A PARTICULAR PART OF THE BUDGET, ONE COMMISSIONER SAYS, I WANT TO FLAG THAT ITEM, AND IF THEY GET ONE OTHER COMMISSIONER TO AGREE WITH THEM, ALL IT TAKES IS TWO, AND WE PUT IT ON THE LIST. AND AS WE GO THROUGH THE BUDGET WITH THEM, WE ACCUMULATE THE FLAGGED ITEMS AND AT THE END WE HAVE THE RECONCILIATION DATE AND THAT'S WHEN WE PUT EVERYTHING ASIDE AND GO TO THAT LIST AND SAY WHAT DO YOU WANT TO DO WITH THESE ITEMS, INCREASE THE BUDGETS, DECREASE THEIR BUDGETS? WE ARE OPEN TO DEAL WITH THOSE ISSUES BECAUSE ONCE WE DELIVERY A BUDGET TO THEM, WE LOOK AT IT AS WE HAVE DONE OUR BEST BASED ON THE GUIDANCE WE HAVE BEEN GIVEN TO DATE, UNDERSTANDING THE PRIORITIES OF THE SEVEN COMMISSIONERS, AND ONCE THEY HAVE IT, THEY CAN DO WHATEVER THEY WANT. THEY CAN RAISE IT, LOWER IT, MOVE IT. IT'S THEIR BUDGET, AND WE DON'T TAKE ANY PRIDE OF AUTHORSHIP THAT IT IS OUR BUDGET AND THEY ARE CHANGING IT. IT'S THEIR BUDGET. >> LET ME DRAW A PARALLEL TO ANOTHER GOVERNMENT DOWN THE STREET. IN THAT GOVERNMENT, THEY DELIVER THE BUDGET TO THE CITY COUNCIL IN THE MIDDLE OF AUGUST. THEY ARE REQUIRED TO ADOPT THAT BUDGET IN THE SAME TIME PERIOD AS OF SEPTEMBER. WE START THE BEGINNING OF JUNE. WE THINK WE HAVE A PROCESS THAT'S ABOVE BOARD, WITH THE PUBLIC HEARINGS WE HAVE. AS IN ANYTHING, YOU CAN ALWAYS DO BETTER, BUT WHAT WE NEED TO DO IS FIND OUT WHAT THE COMMISSION WANTS TO DO AND WE WILL CHANGE IT. >> MR. AMBLER: YOU STARTED THE PROCESS IN JUNE. WHAT IS YOUR OPINION OF HOW THE COUNTY WOULD BENEFIT FROM A LONGER PROCESS, PUSHING THE BUDGET PROCESS TO JANUARY, AS YOU WERE MENTIONING EARLIER IN YOUR REMARKS? I HAVE A SECOND PART BUT I WILL WAIT FOR YOU TO ANSWER THAT. >> MR. HUNZEKER:IT WOULD BE FINE BY US. AS SOME OF YOU MIGHT KNOW, WE HAVE GONE TO A BIENNIAL BUDGET PROCESS SUGGESTED BY COMMISSIONER NORMAN THAT HAS WORKED WELL. IT TAKES SO MUCH TIME AND ENERGY TO FILL OUT ALL THOSE REQUESTS, PROCESS THAT PAPERWORK, READ ALL THAT PAPERWORK, THE BOARD HAS TO MUDDLE THROUGH ALL THAT PAPERWORK. RATHER THAN DOING THAT ON AN ANNUAL BASIS, THE BOARD HAS CHOSEN -- THIS IS OUR THIRD CYCLE -- TO GET ALL THAT INFORMATION ONE YEAR AND -- AN ADOPTED BUDGET BECAUSE WE STILL HAVE TO FOLLOW THE STATUTES -- THEY ADOPT THE BUDGET FOR THE FIRST YEAR AND THEY ADOPT A PLANNED BUDGET FOR THE SECOND YEAR. THIS SUMMER, FOR EXAMPLE, IT IS A MIDYEAR PROCESS. WE WILL BE PROVIDING THEM A BUDGET IN JUNE, BUT WE WILL ONLY PRESENT THEM THOSE ITEMS THAT WE DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT WHEN THEY ADOPTED THE BUDGET LAST REAR FOR CONSIDERATION. THINGS HAPPEN. LEGISLATORS -- LEGISLATURES DO THINGS. SO WE NEED TO AMEND THE BUDGET, REVENUES ARE UP OR DOWN. SO WE HAVE A MINI-BUDGET PROCESS THIS YEAR. IT WON'T BE AS INTENSE, NOT AS MANY WORKSHOPS, NOT AS MUCH HEART BURN, BECAUSE THE AUTHORITY HAS ALREADY ADOPTED THAT PLANNED BUDGET, JUST MODIFYING IT. THAT WORKS WELL. IF THEY WANT TO DO THE TWO-YEAR BUDGET PROCESS, START IN JANUARY, WE CAN DO THAT. 80% OF THE REVENUE THAT SUPPORTS THE GENERAL GOVERNMENT COMES FROM PROPERTY TAXES AND YOU DON'T GET THE FIRST INCLINATION OF THAT NUMBER FROM THE PROPERTY APPRAISER UNTIL JUNE 1. SO YOU CAN START LOOKING AT THE EXPENDITURE SIDE OF THE EQUATION AND HAVE VERY LITTLE INFORMATION ABOUT THE REVENUE SIDE. SO LIKE AT HOME, WHEN YOU ARE WORKING ON YOUR PERSONAL EXPENDITURES, FORGET ABOUT THE REVENUE, OH, YEAH, MAYBE WE WILL BE EATING HOT DOGS IN INSTEAD OF STEAK THREE TIMES A WEEK. WE JUST DON'T GET THAT INFORMATION EARLIER IN THE YEAR. >> MR. AMBLER: THE SECOND QUESTION I HAVE IS ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT HAS BEEN BANDIED ABOUT ALTHOUGH NOT FOCUSED ON BY THIS GROUP WAS THE IDEA OF A COUNTY MAYOR. SINCE YOU ARE THE BUDGET MAVEN AND HEAD OF THE FOOD CHAIN FOR WHO HANDLES THE NUMBERS, IS THERE A WAY OF ESSENTIALLY CALCULATING WHAT THE ADDITION OF AN OFFICE LIKE THAT WOULD DO TO THE COUNTY BUDGET? BECAUSE IT'S NOT JUST ONE INDIVIDUAL. I WOULD ASSUME IT IS THAT INDIVIDUAL AND A WHOLE STAFF OF UNDERLINGS, THAT GO WITH THAT, AND I WOULD IMAGINE WOULD HAVE A SIGNIFICANT IMPACT ON THE OVERALL COUNTY BUDGET, BUT WHAT THAT IS I HAVE NO CLUE, SO I POSE THAT TO YOU. IS THERE A WAY OF A HYPOTHETICAL TO FIGURE OUT WHAT AN OFFICE LIKE THAT WOULD BE LIKE? >> MR. HUNZEKER: I START WITH THE PREMISE IT WOULD BE MORE. EARLIER IN MY CAREER I WORKED IN ANOTHER COUNTY IN A FAR-AWAY PLACE, A COUNTY WITH AN ELECTED COUNTY EXECUTIVE. RELATIVE TO THIS FORM OF GOVERNMENT AND THAT FORM OF GOVERNMENT, IT WAS MORE EXPENSIVE. YOU GET INTO WHAT I MENTIONED EARLIER A SEPARATION OF POWER FORM OF GOVERNMENT. IT'S A REAL IMPORTANT CONCEPT, IN MY MIND, BECAUSE -- AND HAVING WORKED IN BOTH, THAT ONE IN TEN YEARS, AND THIS ONE, TWELVE YEARS -- WE ARE STAFF TO THE BOARD. WE WORK FOR THEM. WE HAVE TO DO WHAT THEY WANT TO DO. WE IMPLEMENT THE POLICIES THEY ADOPT. WE GIVE THEM AGENDA ITEMS, OPTIONS IN THOSE AGENDA ITEMS, AND A RECOMMENDATION, BUT THEY DON'T HAVE TO FOLLOW IT. IN A SEPARATION OF POWERS GOVERNMENTS YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE TO PUT CHECKS AND BALANCES IN PLACE. YOU HAVE POLITICS ENTERING THE EQUATION IN DECISION-MAKING, AND THERE'S GENERALLY LARGER STAFFS, AT LEAST IN MY EXPERIENCE, UNDER THAT FORM OF GOVERNMENT. >> BUT THERE WOULDN'T BE A WAY OF KIND OF TAKING A HYPOTHETICAL OR LOOKING AT THE EXAMPLE OF ANOTHER COUNTY THAT'S DONE IT AND SELECTING FROM THAT EXAMPLE WHAT THE BUDGET ALLOCATIONS ARE FOR RUNNING THE OPERATION UNDER THAT PARADIGM? >> MR. HUNZEKER: WELL, WE COULD HELP YOUR STAFF, BARBARA, DO A LITTLE STUDY. LET ME GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE OF THE LAST COUNTY I WORKED IN. THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE HAS A NICE BIG LIMOUSINE HE WAS DRIVING AROUND, HAD TO GO OUT AND KISS BABIES AND SHAKE HANDS. HE A DRIVER, BUT THAT DRIVER OF THAT LIMOUSINE DIDN'T SHOW UP IN THE BUDGET FOR THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR. IT WAS ONE OF THOSE DEPARTMENTS OUT THERE. AND THERE WERE OTHER PEOPLE THAT WORKED FOR THAT PERSON, BUT THEY WEREN'T IN THAT BUDGET; THEY WERE JUST SCATTERED AROUND THE GOVERNMENT IN VARIOUS DEPARTMENTS. SO IN THAT FORM OF GOVERNMENT, IT LOOKED LIKE A REAL LEAN, MEAN, MACHINE THERE. BUT IF YOU SAW THE STAFF MEETING OF HOW MANY PEOPLE WERE IN THE STAFF MEETING AND SAW HOW MANY PEOPLE WERE CHARGED WITH THE BUDGET, THOSE WERE TWO DIFFERENT NUMBERS. >> I THINK BARBARA AND I TALKED, AND SHE WAS TRYING TO COME UP WITH A LIST. ONE OF THE LISTS HAD TO DO WITH WHAT THE AD VALOREM TAX IS IN THE DIFFERENT COUNTIES, AND THEN WE HAVE BEEN GIVEN A LIST OF THE FORM OF GOVERNMENT. NOW, IS THAT IN OUR DOCUMENTS HERE THIS EVENING? >> IT SAYS ALL THE DIFFERENT MILLAGE RATES FROM THE COUNTIES AND THERE'S ALSO A LIST -- THERE ARE 17 CHARTERED COUNTIES IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA. IT HAS WHETHER THEY ARE ELECTED AT LARGE. I KNOW I GAVE YOU A LOT OF PAPERWORK. I WAS REAL BUSY THE LAST TWO WEEKS. >> I WILL LET YOU ALL LOOK THROUGH THAT AT YOUR LEISURE. WE CAN ALWAYS INVITE MR. HUNZEKER BACK AFTER YOU HAVE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY. WE WERE JUST TRYING TO, BASED ON THE MEETING TONIGHT, GET SOME INFORMATION THAT WOULD HELP YOU IN THE FUTURE. MR. HUNZEKER? >> ONE THING THAT MIGHT HELP YOU WHEN YOU LOOK AT THESE MILLAGE RATES, COMING FROM MY 35-YEARS OF EXPERIENCE. IF YOU LOOK AT THE MILLAGE RATE, COMPARED TO THE TOTAL REVENUE, THEY MAY HAVE OTHER REVENUES THEY USE TO SUPPORT THEIR OPERATING BUDGET. WE USE 80% OF OUR BUDGET, COMES FROM PROPERTY TAXES. OTHERS WHO HAVE MORE REVENUE SOURCE MASS HAVE A MILLAGE RATE THAT ARE LOWER BECAUSE THEY HAVE LOWER REVENUES TO SUPPORT THEIR OPERATING BUDGET SO IT IS MISLEADING IF YOU LOOK AT JUST THAT ONE PIECE. >> PERHAPS YOU AND BARBARA CAN GET TOGETHER AND LOOK AT SOME OF THOSE NUMBERS BASED ON THE WORK SHE HAS ALREADY BROUGHT. MR. LABOUR? >>STEVE LABOUR: I SEE ON YOUR SCHEDULE YOU HAVE THE CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICER BUDGET REQUESTED BY APRIL 16 SO I SUSPECT RIGHT AROUND THAT TIME DEPARTMENTS WERE PROBABLY GETTING THEIR PAPERWORK IN TO YOU AS WELL. MY QUESTION IS, HOW DOES THE CITIZEN BECOME PLUGGED INTO THE BUDGET PROPERTY BEFORE THE WORKSHOPS, BEFORE THE PUBLIC HEARINGS, NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATIONS? I ALSO KNOW IN THE COUNTY THERE ARE NEIGHBORHOOD ASSOCIATIONS THAT HAVE GROUPED TOGETHER FOR THEIR AREA-WIDE, THEN SUN CITY CENTER, AND PLANT CITY. HOW DO THOSE FOLKS PLUG INTO THE BUDGET PROCESS BEFORE YOU START FINALIZING IT TO THEN SEND IT IN DRAFT FORM TO THE BOARD? >> IF ERIC JOHNSON ISN'T SNEAKING UP BEHIND ME, BECAUSE HE WOULD LOVE TO TELL YOU THIS, HIS BUDGET PROCESS HAS WON SH NATIONAL AWARDS. ONE OF THE THINGS HE DOES IS HE HAS THAT BUDGET ONLINE THE DAY THE ADMINISTRATOR SUBMITS IT TO THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS. YOU CAN GO IN AND MEASURE THE NUMBER OF HITS THAT YOU GET TO THAT ONLINE BUDGET (HITS), THAT THE PUBLIC CAN GO IN AND DOWNLOAD ANY AND ALL OF THE COUNTY BUDGET ON THE DAY IT GOES TO THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS. IN ADDITION, WE PROVIDE HARD COPIES OF THAT BUDGET TO EVERY LIBRARY IN HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY, AND WE HAVE PROVIDED -- I THINK YOU HAVE IN FRONT OF YOU THE DISKETTE THERE THAT HAS THE BUDGET. THE COST OF THAT IS ABOUT $5? OH, EXCUSE ME. I OVERPRICED IT. FOR YOU, IT'S $1.50 TO PRODUCE THAT DISKETTE. THE BUDGET DOCUMENTS IN HARD FORM COST ABOUT $75 TO PRODUCE ALL THE WRITTEN DOCUMENTS WE HAVE. SO WE WOULD JUST AS SOON MAKE SURE THAT EVERYBODY THAT CAN, USE A DISKETTE. IT'S ALL IN THERE. YOU CAN USE SEARCHES TO FIND WHATEVER YOU WANT IN THERE. ALL THE DATA THAT ARE IN ALL THE BUDGET DOCUMENTS ARE OUT THERE. IN ADDITION, YOU HAVE EACH RECEIVED A COPY OF THE TAXPAYERS GUIDE. IF PLAGIARIZING IS THE SINCEREST FORM OF FLATTERY, THAT DOCUMENT HAS BEEN COPIED BY OVER 400 GOVERNMENTS THROUGHOUT THE WORLD, AND HAS WON SEVERAL NATIONAL AWARDS, BECAUSE IN SHORT, EASY TO READ, PLAIN ENGLISH, IT EXPLAINS HOW THIS BUDGET WORKS IN THE GOVERNMENT. AT HOME WE HAVE A CHECKING ACCOUNT, PAY THE MORTGAGE, BUY THE GROCERIES, GET THE DRY CLEANING, AND USE JUST ONE CHECKING ACCOUNT. WE HAVE 36 MAJOR FUNDS AND WITHIN THOSE FUNDS WE HAVE 300 SUB FUNDS AND THEY HAVE TO BE BALANCED SEPARATELY. THAT'S NOT BECAUSE WE WANT TO DO IT BUT STATUTORY REQUIREMENTS FOR HOW WE ACCOUNT FOR CERTAIN DOLLARS TO SET ASIDE SEPARATE CHECKING ACCOUNTS. IT'S NOT SOMETHING YOU WOULD FIND IN YOUR NORMAL BUSINESS OPERATIONS, THOSE OF YOU IN PRIVATE SECTOR. IT IS MUCH MORE COMPLICATED IN THIS ENVIRONMENT, BUT THAT TAXPAYERS GUIDE TAKES SOME OF THE MYSTERY OUT OF IT. >> I HAVE ONE QUICK FOLLOW-UP. ESPECIALLY SINCE WE HAVE GONE TO A TWO-YEAR BUDGET CYCLE, IT WOULD SEEM TO ME IF DEPARTMENTS ARE TRYING TO SET THEIR WORK PROGRAMS FOR THOSE TWO YEARS, WHILE IT IS CERTAINLY GOOD THAT ON THE SAME DAY THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS GETS THE BUDGET, THE PUBLIC DOES, MY QUESTION IS: HOW DO THEY IMPACT THOSE DECISIONS ABOUT WHAT THE WORK PROGRAM SHOULD BE FOR THOSE DEPARTMENTS PRIOR TO YOU MAKING FINAL DECISIONS AND PUTTING IT IN DRAFT FORM FOR THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS? IS THERE A MECHANISM TO WELCOME THAT INFORMATION? >> MR. HUNZEKER: WELL, IF ALL OF OUR DEPARTMENTS ARE INTO COMMUNICATING TO THEIR CLIENTS, IF YOU WILL, THOSE PEOPLE THEY SERVE, AND THEY ARE WELL AWARE OF THE COMMUNITY NEEDS -- FOR EXAMPLE, THE PARKS DEPARTMENT HAS FRIENDS OF THE PARKS DEPARTMENT. THEY COLLECT INPUT, MAKE THEIR DESIRES KNOWN TO THE LEADERS, WHAT THEY NEED AND WANT. THE BOARD HAS THEIR TOWN HALL MEETINGS WHERE THE PUBLIC COMES AND TALK TO THE BOARD ABOUT THINGS THEY LIKE AND DON'T LIKE. BUT IF YOUR QUESTION IS GOING TO A SPECIFIC DEPARTMENT -- AGING SERVICES -- AND THE PUBLIC WANTS TO INFLUENCE WHAT IT IS THAT AGING SERVICES IS GOING TO DO, THE PEOPLE IN THIS COUNTY ARE NOT SHY. THEY PICK UP THE PHONE AND CALL THE DIRECTOR OF AGING SERVICES, AND THEY START TALKING TO HIM. THEY GET A SENSE OF WHAT IS GOING ON OUT THERE, AND THEY HAVE A FINGER ON THE PULSE. BUT A FORMAL PROCESS WHERE THE PUBLIC GETS INVOLVED EARLY ON, WHEN THE DEPARTMENT IS TRYING TO FORMULATE A BUDGET? THERE ISN'T THE FORMAL PROCESS. I IS A VERY INFORMAL PROCESS. >> THANK YOU. >> MR. HUNZEKER, DO THESE GO TO THE LIBRARIES SO PEOPLE DON'T HAVE TO -- >> YES. >> WHEN YOU ASKED MR. BALLARD A QUESTION ON THE AUDIT, IT TRIGGERED ONE. MR. BELDEN, MR. HILL, OR ANYONE ELSE -- >> CAN YOU GET TO THE MIC? >> I'M SORRY. IT GOES BACK TO RICHARD AKE'S OFFICE, THEN WHAT HAPPENED TO IT? >> MR. HUNZEKER: IT WILL BE DEPOSITED IN THE APPROPRIATE FUND. AS MR. BELDEN INDICATED, HE'S A FEE BUDGET. HE GETS 2% OF WHAT HE COLLECTS. IT DEPENDS ON WHO HE'S COLLECTING IT FOR. HE COLLECTS TAXES FOR HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY GOVERNMENT FOR THE GENERAL GOVERNMENT, AND THE MILLAGE THAT WE COLLECT FROM THE GENERAL GOVERNMENT ON A COUNTY-WIDE BASIS. AS I SAID, WE HAVE A SEPARATE FUND FOR THE UNINCORPORATED AREA TAX. AND HE ALSO E COLLECTS TAXES FOR THE PORT AUTHORITY, THE CHILDREN'S BOARD, AND FOR HARTLINE. SO WHEN HE RETURNS MONEY, IT DEPENDS ON WHOSE MONEY HE'S RETURNING AND IT GOES TO THE APPROPRIATE FUND. >> I SEE. THANKS. >> MR. -- >> I HAVE NEVER HEARD OF SURPLUS MONEY IN HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY. I WAS WONDERING IF AT ANY TIME THERE HAS BEEN ANY, BECAUSE WE ARE ALWAYS RUNNING SHORT. I WAS WONDERING ABOUT, IN CASE OF EMERGENCY, WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO FIND SOME MONEY. I WONDER ABOUT THAT. >> MR. HUNZEKER: LET ME JUST TELL YOU. EVERY YEAR, THERE IS SURPLUS MONEY, BUT IT DEPENDS ON HOW YOU DEFINE SURPLUS. REMEMBER, WHEN THE BOARD ADOPTS A BUDGET, FROM THE LEGAL STANDPOINT, THAT MEANS THE PEOPLE THEY APPROPRIATED THAT MONEY TO, CAN'T SPEND ANY MORE THAN THAT. NOBODY EVER SPENDS RIGHT TO THE LAST NICKEL. YOU SPEND WHAT YOU NEED IN ORDER TO DO THE JOB. IF YOU DON'T NEED IT ALL, YOU HAVE UNSPENT DOLLARS AT THE END OF THE YEAR. THOSE ROLL OVER INTO THE FUND BALANCE. IN PREPARING FOR THE NEXT BUDGET YEAR, WE TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION. IT IS SURPLUS, AND WE HAVE A TIGGER OR SOMETHING WITH THE EXCESS FUND. IT ALL ROLLS INTO THE FUND BALANCE, ALL ACCOUNTED FOR EACH YEAR, GETS ROLLED INTO THE EXPENDITURES FOR THE NEXT YEAR AND THE BOARD KNOWS THAT NUMBER FROM THE PRIOR YEAR WHEN THEY ARE ESTABLISHING THE BUDGET FOR THE SCENT YEAR AND WE PUT THAT INTO THE EQUATION SO THAT THE BOARD, IN ORDER TO BALANCE THE BUDGET -- AND THE LAST THING THEY SAID WAS THE MILLAGE RATES. THEY LOOK AT ALL THE REVENUES THAT ARE AVAILABLE TO SUPPORT THE EXPENSES OF THE GOVERNMENT, AND TO BALANCE THE EQUATION, IS WHAT HAPPENS. SO IT'S EXCESS, BUT IT'S ACCOUNTED FOR. >> MR. WILKES: WHEN YOU SAY AVAILABLE REVENUES, ARE THESE EXISTING REVENUES IN THE COUNTY, OR CAN IT INCLUDE NEW OR PROPOSED FEES OR TAXES? >> IT ALL COMES TOGETHER. CERTAIN FUNDS WILL HAVE -- TAKE THE TWO GENERAL FUNDS. I DON'T KNOW IF I NEED TO EXPLAIN THAT FOR SOME OF YOU. THE GENERAL FUND THAT'S FOR THE COUNTY-WIDE BASIS OR FOR THOSE SERVICE THAT IS THE COUNTY PROVIDES THROUGHOUT THE COUNTY, EVEN IN THE THREE MUNICIPALITIES, AND THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS SITS IF YOU WILL WITH THE COUNTY-WIDE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS, AND THEY MAKE DECISIONS ABOUT THOSE PROGRAMS. ANIMAL SERVICES, THE SOCIAL SERVICE PROGRAMS, THE HEAD START PROGRAMS, THE CHILDREN'S SERVICES, THE SHERIFFS AND JUDICIARY EXPENSES, THE SHERIFFS EXPENSES AS IT RELATES TO THE COURT SYSTEM, AND THE OPERATING OF THE JAILS. THOSE ARE COUNTY-WIDE FUNCTIONS. THEN THE BOARD ALSO WARES THE HAT OF THE CITY COUNCIL FOR THE UNINCORPORATED PORTION OF THE COUNTY. THOSE SERVICES ARE THE SERVICES THAT THE COUNTY PROVIDES TO THE UNINCORPORATED RESIDENTS AS IF THEY WERE A CITY. IN THE THREE MUNICIPALITIES THEY EACH HAVE THEIR OWN POLICE DEPARTMENT, PARKS DEPARTMENT. WELL IN THE UNINCORPORATED AREA, THE BOARD MAKES DECISIONS AND COLLECTS REVENUES FROM THE UNINCORPORATED AREAS FOR THOSE MUNICIPAL-TYPE SERVICES -- PARKS, FIRE, EMS, PLANNING FUNCTIONS, AND THE SHERIFFS PATROL IN THE UNINCORPORATED AREA. SO THOSE ARE ACCOUNTED FOR SEPARATELY IN THE UNINCORPORATED GENERAL FUND. SO THAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE TWO. EACH OF THOSE FUNDS HAS PROPERTY TAXES THAT ACCOUNT FOR 80% BUT THEY ALSO HAVE SOME FEES. WHEN YOU GO TO THE PARKS, SOME OF THE PROGRAMS IN THE PARK AREA, YOU PAY SOME FEES, AND THOSE WILL GO INTO THE FEES FOR THE UNINCORPORATED GENERAL FUND. SOME OF THE SERVICE THAT IS THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY USES FROM THE PLANNING AREA WILL PAY FEES. THOSE WILL ALSO GO INTO THAT EQUATION. SO THE MIX OF THOSE REVENUES WILL ALWAYS STAY IN THE FUND ALONG WITH THE PROPERTY TAXES TO HELP BALANCE THE EXPENSE OF THAT FUND. NOW, IF THE BOARD WANTS TO INSTITUTE NEW FEES AND CHARGES, THE FIRST THING YOU HAVE TO LOOK FOR IS WHETHER WE HAVE STATUTORY AUTHORITY TO LEVY THAT FEE OR CHARGE BECAUSE COUNTY GOVERNMENTS ARE AN EFFECTIVE ARM OF STATE GOVERNMENT AND WE CAN'T PUT AN INCOME TAX IN PLACE IN HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY. THAT'S PROHIBITED BY STATE STATUTE SO WE COULDN'T DO THAT. IF WE WANTED TO PUT A FEE ON FOR AN ADDITIONAL PARK FEE, YOU GO TO THE STATE STATUTES AND SEE THAT THAT PROVIDES FOR THOSE TYPES OF FEES FOR PARKS PROGRAMS, AND WE COULD IMPLEMENT ADDITIONAL PARK FEES IF WE WANTED TO, AND THUS LOWER THE BURDEN ON THE PROPERTY TAXPAYERS. IT'S A MIX. >> I HAVE HAD TWO MEMBERS WHO HAVE ASKED TO ASK FOLLOW-UP QUESTIONS SO IF YOU COULD PLEASE MAKE IT BRIEF, MR. WHITE THEN MR. BALLARD. >> MR. KARL WARREN SUBMITTED A DOCUMENT TO US. HE IS REQUESTING A 3% CAP. IS THAT LEGAL? I DON'T KNOW IF I SHOULD BE ASKING YOU THIS QUESTION, A LEGAL QUESTION. >> I HAVE SOME ATTORNEYS IN THE ROOM THAT MIGHT HELP ME. I THINK PROCEDURALLY, IF THE BOARD WANTED TO LIMIT ITSELF, THE BOARD COULD LIMIT ITSELF IF IT WANTED TO. >> OKAY. MY FOLLOW-UP QUESTION. YOU TALKED ABOUT THE BUDGET IS PREPARED, THE STATE STATUTES. ONCE THIS PROCESS IS COMPLETE AND THERE'S A NEED FOR A CHANGE, CAN YOU JUST EXPLAIN THAT A LITTLE BIT? >> IT'S CALLED A BUDGET AMENDMENT. WHEN THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS ADOPTS -- LET'S TALK AGAIN IN THE TWO MAJOR TAX FUNDS, THE TWO GENERAL FUNDS THAT IS WHERE THE PROPERTY TAXES GOES INTO, WE ALWAYS PROVIDE FOR RESERVE FOR CONTINGENCY. THE RESERVE FOR CONTINGENCIES IS A COUPLE MILLION DOLLARS. BETWEEN THOSE TWO TAX FUNDS YOU ARE REALLY TALKING ABOUT $600 MILLION, PERHAPS. SO A COUPLE OF MILLION DOLLARS ISN'T A LOT, BUT CERTAINLY THINGS ARE GOING TO HAPPEN THROUGHOUT THE YEAR THAT YOU JUST DIDN'T PLAN ON, AND YOU DON'T WANT TO, IN MIDYEAR, EVER HAVE A BUDGET CRISIS WHERE YOU EVER HAVE TO GO CUT SOMEBODY'S BUDGET SO YOU CAN FUND SOMETHING THAT YOU WANT. SO IN PRUDENT FINANCIAL PLANNING WE ALWAYS HAVE A RESERVE, AS MOST OF YOU US HAVE AT HOME, WE ALWAYS HAVE SOMETHING A LITTLE SET ASIDE WHEN THE AIR CONDITIONER BREAKS DURING THE YEAR. SO DO WE HERE. IF IT IS NOT SPENT AT THE END OF THE YEARS, IT ROLLS OVER TO THE NEXT YEAR. >> MR. BALLARD: WHILE I WAS REVIEWING THIS -- I MAY PUT YOU ON THE SPOT AND YOU MAY HAVE TO DEFER TO MR. JOHNSON -- ON THE DEBT SERVICE, IT DROPPED FROM THE ACTUAL TO THE PROPOSED OR ADOPTED BUDGET, FROM $152 MILLION TO $87 MILLION. THAT MEANS THAT THE COUNTY EITHER REFINANCED OR GOT A WIND FALL OF MONEY AND PAID OFF A LOT OF DEBT. THAT'S THE FIRST PART. THE SECOND PART, IS THERE ANYWHERE IN HERE THAT SHOWS THE INDEBTEDNESS OF HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY? >> NOT IN THE TAXPAYERS GUIDE. BUT IF YOU WOULD -- OH! SO HE WAS WRONG! ON PAGE 36 -- >> THAT'S THE ONE I HAVE HERE, PAGE 36. LOOKS LIKE IT DROPPED $60 MILLION ON THE DEBT SERVICE. >> IF IT'S ALL RIGHT WITH YOU, I WOULD LIKE TO BE ACCURATE IN MY ANSWERS, SO I WOULD LIKE TO SUBMIT TO YOU IN WRITING, THE ANSWERS TO THOSE TWO QUESTIONS. THE TOTAL INDEBTEDNESS FOR HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY AND WHY IT IS THAT THE 152 MILLION WENT TO 87. I WOULD LIKE TO BE REAL SPECIFIC IN THAT ANSWER. IT'S NOT THAT WE HAD THIS WIND FALL OF MONEY AND PAID OFF ALL THIS DEBT. THAT'S NOT THE ANSWER. I WOULDN'T WANT YOU TO BELIEVE THAT. PERHAPS WE REFINANCED SOME DEBT OR SOME BONDS WERE PAID OFF IN THEIR NORMAL CYCLE. >> I DIDN'T KNOW IF THERE WAS SOMETHING THAT REFERRED TO THE TOTAL INDEBTEDNESS IN THIS. >> WE HAVE THAT INFORMATION IN THE DESK ET. I WILL PROVIDE YOU A ONE-PAGE DOCUMENT TO BARBARA, WHO CAN PROVIDE A COPY TO ALL OF YOU. >> THANK YOU, SIR. >> BOARD MEMBERS, ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OF MR. HUNZEKER? I THINK YOU WILL GET OFF EASY, SIR. I HOPE YOU COME BACK IF YOU HAVE NEW INFORMATION OR HEAR US DISCUSSING THINGS THAT YOU THINK YOU WOULD LIKE TO RESPOND TO. >> IF THERE IS ANY TIME YOU WOULD LIKE ME TO COME BACK, I WOULD BE HAPPY TO COME BACK. I WOULD BE HAPPY TO SEND ANYBODY FROM THE STAFF TO COME VISIT WITH YOU, AND WE WISH YOU WELL IN YOUR ENDEAVORS. THANK YOU AGAIN. >> THANKS TO ERIC JOHNSON ALSO FOR BEING HERE. WE APPRECIATE HIS SUPPORT IN ALL OF THESE DOCUMENTS AND CONGRATULATIONS TO THE COUNTY ON THEIR BUDGET AWARD! >> BARBARA: I JUST WANT TO SAY, THIS IS WHAT IS ON THE DISK. THAT IS WHY I DID NOT COPY IT. AND THERE IS ONE MORE BOOK IN THERE. >> THANK YOU. >> MADAM CHAIRMAN, I DIDN'T GET A RESPONSE TO THE QUESTION ABOUT THE AUDITOR. >> I THINK THAT QUESTION WAS ASKED. >> I MISSED IT. >> I THINK PERHAPS THAT WE CAN GET -- >> CAPTIONER RERUNS. >> -- THE DETAIL FOR YOU. >> ON OUR AGENDA, OUR NEXT ITEM IS TO MEET AND SPEAK WITH OUR CONFLICT ATTORNEYS, BUT I BELIEVE MARY HELEN CAMPBELL FROM THE COUNTY ATTORNEYS OFFICE HAD A FEW COMMENTS SHE WANTED TO MAKE BEFORE WE MOVED INTO THE INTERVIEWS WITH THE ATTORNEYS. >> ARE YOU SURE YOU ALL DON'T WANT TO TAKE FIVE MINUTES? >> I DON'T THINK THIS WILL TAKE LONG. THEN WE WILL TAKE A REGULAR BREAK. >> MARY HELEN, IT'S BEEN A HARD DAY, HASN'T IT? >> MS. CAMPBELL: MARY HELEN CAMPBELL, ASSISTANT COUNTY ATTORNEY. JUST BRIEFLY. WE PASSED OUT OUR LEGAL OPINION CONCERNING THE QUESTION YOU HAD LAST MEETING ON WHETHER YOU GO TO TWO GENERAL ELECTIONS. IN SUMMARY, THE ANSWER APPEARS TO BE YES. WE WANT THE BOARD TOBACCO AWARE THAT HAS NOT BEEN DONE BY A CHARTER REVIEW BOARD BEFORE AND MAY BE SUBJECT TO A LEGAL CHALLENGE AND WE DON'T KNOW HOW A COURT MAY INTERPRET THOSE PROVISIONS IN THE CHARTER. IF THERE ARE QUESTIONS WE CAN ANSWER. >>STEVE LABOUR: THANK YOU FOR YOUR JOB IN RESEARCHING THIS. MY QUESTION IS, SINCE I SUSPECT IT WILL BE THE COUNTY'S LEGAL DEPARTMENT THAT WOULD DEFEND US IN A FUTURE SUIT, BUT LET'S SAY WE PUT SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT FOR NOVEMBER AND SOMEONE WANTED TO SAY THAT THEN WE HAVE SUNSET OURSELVES, THEY DON'T IN FACT INTERPRET THE CASE LAW OR THE STATUTE THE SAME WAY AS YOU AND THEY SUE THE COUNTY AND SAY THAT WE MUST CEASE, WE CANNOT CONTINUE TO MEET, OR WE DEFINITELY CANNOT PUT SOMETHING ELSE ON THE BALLOT LATER ON. ARE YOU COMFORTABLE WITH DEFENDING OUR POSITION AS YOU WROTE IT IN THE MEMO THAT WE COULD CONTINUE TO MEET? >> OF COURSE OUR OFFICE IS COMFORTABLE WITH THE POSITION WE STATED. IF THERE WAS A CONFLICT THAT EXISTED AT THE TIME, WE WOULD OF COURSE HAVE TO LOOK INTO THAT AND SEE IF THAT WAS AN ISSUE. >> OKAY. THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU, MR. WHITE? >> MR. WHITE: YES. ONE THING I WANTED TO SAY. ANYBODY CAN BE SUED AT ANY TIME UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES, IN ANY WAY. >> TWO BOARD MEMBERS ARE HAPPY ABOUT THAT (LAUGHTER). >> THREE. (LAUGHTER). >>GERALD WHITE: IF YOU THINK ABOUT OUR STATE OF FLORIDA CONSTITUTION, THE ONLY THING I KNOW OF THAT'S A LIMIT IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA IS TERM LIMITS. AND THAT'S, WHAT, EIGHT YEARS FOR A TOTAL? I CAN'T THINK OF ANYTHING ELSEWHERE THERE'S A LIMIT. IF YOU LOOK IN AMERICA, WE HAVE -- IN CONGRESS, THEY VOTE ON THE SAME ISSUES OVER AND OVER AGAIN UNTIL THEY PASS, AND THEY DO IT IN TALLAHASSEE. THEY DO IT HERE LOCALLY. SO I DON'T SEE A PROBLEM WITH CONDUCTING BUSINESS LIKE THAT. THE CHARTER IS DESIGNED FOR THE AVERAGE CITIZEN TO UNDERSTAND. I'M NOT AN ATTORNEY BUT AS A CITIZEN, I DON'T SEE ANYTHING STOPPING US FROM MOVING FORWARD THIS NOVEMBER IF WE SEE FIT AND CONTINUING ON UNTIL WE EXHAUST OUR AUTHORITY AS A GROUP. >> YES, SIR, WE WOULD AGREE WITH THAT. >> YOU OUGHT TO LOOK, SINCE 1983, IF THERE IS ANY MENTION OF THIS KIND OF ISSUE BEFORE. IF THERE HAS NOT BEEN, WE WANT TO QUALIFY THAT A COURT COULD LOOK AT IT DIFFERENTLY THAN WE ARE AT THIS POINT. >> WE COULD FIND TWO COURTS AND GET TWO DIFFERENT ANSWERS. >> THEN WE GO TO THE SUPREME COURT AND GET ANOTHER ONE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> MARY HELEN CAMPBELL, COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE: AN ISSUE CAME UP AT THE LAST MEETING AS TO RESEARCH AND WHEN THE CHARTER WAS ORIGINALLY ADOPTED AND THERE WERE SOME PROBLEMS GETTING THE PRECLEARANCE. IN YOUR COPIES OF YOUR BOOKS, AND I THINK KEN MIGHT HAVE PASSED IT AROUND, IS A LITTLE SUMMARY OF THE HISTORY OF WHAT WAS DONE IN THE INTERJECTION. WE HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO LOCATE OUR FILES. WE NEED TO GO TO THE FEDERAL COURTHOUSE TO PULL THE ACTUAL CASE, WHICH WE HAVE NOT DONE YET. I JUST WANT TO GIVE YOU A STATUS OF THE SUMMARY THAT I GAVE YOU, OUTLINING WHAT HAPPENED. I WASN'T SURE HOW MUCH DETAIL THE BOARD WOULD WANT AS FAR AS WHAT HAD HAPPENED IN 1983-84 WHEN THE CHARTER WAS FIRST ADOPTED. BUT WE CAN GO AND PULL THOSE RECORDS. WE JUST DON'T HAVE THEM AVAILABLE YET TONIGHT. >> I WAS JUST CURIOUS WHY ALL OF A SUDDEN THEY WITHDREW THEIR OBJECTIONS IN AN ABOUT-FACE. >> I'M NOT SURE. WE DID RESEARCH ALL OF THE BOCC MINUTES THAT BASICALLY DON'T HAVE A WHOLE LOT MORE INFORMATION ON THEM THAN WHAT YOU HAVE IN YOUR SUMMARY. I'M NOT SURE IF THE COURT FILE WOULD REFLECT MUCH MORE. IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN A LOT OF THAT WAS DONE VERBALLY. BUT WE WILL HAVE TO PULL THE FILE AND SEE IF THE BOARD WANTS US TO KEEP LOOKING INTO IT. THEN WE CAN REPORT BACK. >> THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. >> BOARD MEMBERS, WE HAVE TWO ATTORNEYS WHO HAVE AGREED FROM THE START TO SERVE AS OUR CONFLICT ATTORNEYS, SO IT IS OUR OBLIGATION TO MEET THEM THIS EVENING AND SELECT ONE OR THE OTHER TO SERVE AS OUR CONFLICT ATTORNEY. AND SINCE THEY ARE LISTED AS LADIES BEFORE GENTLEMAN, WE WILL START THAT WAY. MARSHA RYDBERG FIRST, WE THANK YOU FOR COMING THIS EVENING. I APOLOGIZE FOR THE DELAY IN OUR START THIS EVENING. I HOPE IT DOESN'T HAPPEN AGAIN. WE WILL TRY TO BE BETTER ORGANIZED. >> MS. RYDBERG: ALL RIGHT WITH ME. I WOULD HAVE BEEN AT THE WRONG PLACE. I WAS DOWNSTAIRS. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. I IS MY PLEASURE TO BE IN FRONT OF YOU AND I VERY MUCH APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO SERVE. I PRESENTED MOST EVERYTHING THAT I HAVE TO SAY IN THE WRITTEN PACKAGE, AND I SUSPECT THAT THE OLD ADAGE THAT THE BRAIN CAN ONLY ABSORB AS MUCH AS THE SEAT CAN ENDURE MAY BE GETTING CLOSE TO BEING ON FOCUS AT THIS POINT. I HAVE GIVEN YOU MY RESUME. YOU KNOW THAT I HAVE BEEN ACTIVE IN THE COMMUNITY. ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I LEARNED IN MY TEN YEARS AS ASSIST AT THAT POINT CITY ATTORNEY FOR TEMPLE TERRACE IS I LEARNED EXACTLY WHO THE POLICY MAKERS ARE (ASSIST AT THAT POINT CITY ATTORNEY) -- THAT'S YOU FOLKS -- AND THE ROLL OF THE ATTORNEY, MUCH LIKE I TRIED TO TELL MY CHILDREN, WITHOUT SUCCESS, IS YOU SPEAK ONLY WHEN SPOKEN TO, AND YOU TRY TO GIVE A DIRECT ANSWER, IF AT ALL POSSIBLE, WITH NO FUDGE IN IT, ALTHOUGH THAT'S TOUGH FOR AN ATTORNEY. MY PREFERENCE WOULD BE TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS AND TO PRETTY MUCH STAND ON WHAT I HAVE WRITTEN, AND ON MY SERVICE TO THE COMMUNITY AS YOU SEE IT. I DO WANT TO SAY, THOUGH, I WOULD BE REMISS IN NOT SAYING TO YOU, THAT I WOULD REALLY HONOR AND TREASURE THE OPPORTUNITY TO ASSIST THIS BOARD IN TRYING TO CONTINUE TO IMPROVE THE GREATEST PLACE IN THIS WORLD TO LIVE. I WAS BORN AND RAISED HERE. MY PARENTS WERE. MY GRANDPARENTS LIVED HERE AND I EVEN HAD SOME GREAT-GRANDPARENTS THAT LIVED HERE. SO IT WOULD BE A SPECIAL OPPORTUNITY TO ME TO GET TO HELP AND SERVE Y'ALL IN ACCOMPLISHING YOUR TASKS. I WILL ANSWER QUESTIONS IF YOU WOULD LIKE. >> THANK YOU, MS. RYDBERG. ONE OF THE QUESTIONS I WOULD LIKE EACH ATTORNEY TO ANSWER, I HAVE TWO QUESTIONS WE NEED TO KNOW THE ANSWERS TO BEFORE WE START. ONE IS, DO YOU HAVE ANY CONTRACTS WITH HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY OR ANY OF THE ORGANIZATIONS THAT WOULD COME UNDER THE CHARTER THAT YOU COULD DESCRIBE TO US, AND DO YOU HAVE ANY LAWSUITS AGAINST THE COUNTY, AT THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATION, AT THIS TIME, OR ANY OF THOSE ORGANIZATION THAT IS COME UNDER THE CHARTER? >> MS. RYDBERG: SO FAR AS I KNOW, I HAVE NO CONTRACTS WITH ANYBODY -- I DON'T EVEN HAVE A WATER AND SEWER CONTRACT WITH HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY, AS FAR AS I KNOW, BECAUSE I LIVE IN THE CITY. BUT I DON'T THINK I HAVE ANY CONTRACTS. AS I MENTIONED IN THE PREPARED REMARKS TWO MONTHS AGO, I LEFT A LARGE FIRM THAT I WAS WITH, AND MY HUSBAND AND I AND ONE OTHER PERSON ARE PRACTICING TOGETHER. AND AS FAR AS I KNOW, NO ONE IN OUR FIRM HAS ANY CONTRACTS WITH THE COUNTY OR WITH THE CITY. I AM GOING THROUGH -- OR WITH ANY OF THEIR AGENCIES. I DO HAVE SOME LITIGATION AGAINST THE CITY AND I HAVE ONE LAWSUIT WHICH I THINK MAY BE ON THE VERGE OF GETTING RESOLVED -- IN WHICH I HAVE COUNSELLED AGAINST THE COUNTY AND THE SCHOOL BOARD. THAT INVOLVES THE LUTZ LAKE FERN ROAD SCHOOL SITE. >> AND THAT WASN'T RESOLVED YET? >> MS. RYDBERG: IT IS NOT RESOLVED. THE LAWSUIT IS NOT RESOLVE. THE SCHOOL BOARD, I THINK, HAS INDICATED THAT THEY ARE NOT GOING TO GO FORWARD WITH THAT SITE, AND SO ULTIMATELY -- >> THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS. >> MS. RYDBERG:YOU ARE RIGHT, IS NOT SETTLED YET. >>DENISE LASHER: YOU ARE ASKING THAT QUESTION. DO YOU PERCEIVE THAT AS A PROBLEM? >> JAN SMITH: I JUST WANTED THINGS TO BE OUT IN THE OPEN SO IF THERE IS A CONFLICT, ANYBODY WOULD BE AWARE OF A CONFLICT. THAT'S FOR EACH PERSON ON THIS BOARD TO DECIDE. >> DENISE LASHER: AREN'T THERE BAR RULES RELATED TO CONFLICTS, AS RELATE TO LITIGATION? >> YES, THERE ARE. >> I HAVE A QUESTION. >> LET'S GO AROUND AS PEOPLE HAVE RAISED THEIR HANDS. MR. LABOUR? WERE YOU FINISHED, MS. LASHER? >>DENISE LASHER: NO, I WAS JUST GOING TO SAY, THIS POSITION IS TO ADVISE US IN THOSE CAPACITIES WHERE THE COUNTY ATTORNEY FEELS LIKE THERE'S A CONFLICT ON BEHALF OF THE COUNTY ATTORNEY, AND YOU KNOW, WE ARE NOT -- CONCEDING WE ARE REPRESENTING THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS. >> JAN SMITH: THAT'S RIGHT. WE ARE INDEPENDENT OF THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS. >> MS. RYDBERG: PERSONALLY, I DON'T SEE THAT AS A PROBLEM. >> JAN SMITH: I ONLY RAISE IT BECAUSE THAT'S AN ISSUE THAT I BELIEVE THE BOARD HAS THE RIGHT TO KNOW -- >> MS. RYDBERG: SURELY. >> JAN SMITH: -- IS DO THEY HAVE ANY CONTRACTS TO PROVIDE ANY SERVICE TO ANY AGENCIES OR BOARDS OR ADMINISTRATIVE SERVICE UNDER THE COUNTY OR DO THEY HAVE ANY LAWSUITS. YOU NEVER KNOW WHAT IS GOING TO COLOR SOMEONE'S OPINION, SO I JUST THINK HAVING IT ON THE TABLE JUST FOR CLARIFICATION. EACH BOARD MEMBER WILL STATE THEIR OWN BEEN. MR. LABOUR? >>STEVE LABOUR: THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIRMAN. I THINK IT WAS AN APPROPRIATE QUESTION, BECAUSE I THINK, WHILE I KNOW MS. RYDBERG AND HAVE WORKED WITH HER -- OFTENTIMES ON THE OTHER SIDE -- I FOUND HER TO BE AN INCREDIBLE POSITIVE ADVOCATE FOR HER CLIENT. BUT SOME COULD RAISE IF YOU HAVE A LAWSUIT AGAINST THE COUNTY, THERE MIGHT BE A VINDICTIVENESS THAT MIGHT ENTER INTO YOUR OPINION IF WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THE COUNTY'S ATTORNEYS OFFICE AND YOU FELT THEY WERE RUNNING AMUCK. MY BELIEF IS THAT THE ONLY TIME WE ARE GOING TO USE A CONFLICT ATTORNEY IS WHEN WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THE COUNTY ATTORNEY'S POWERS. I DON'T SUSPECT -- I HOPE THAT WE DON'T GET INVOLVED IN "WE DON'T LIKE THE ANSWER WE GOT FROM THE COUNTY ATTORNEY ON A DIFFERENT ISSUE" AND WE CALL YOU UP AND SAY "HEY, WHAT'S YOUR TAKE ON THIS?" THAT'S NOT HOW I PERCEIVE WE WOULD USE YOU. MY QUESTION IS SIMPLE: WHAT IS YOUR WORKING RELATIONSHIP WITH THE COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, AND DO YOU HAVE ANY PROBLEM IN ANSWERING ANY QUESTIONS WE MIGHT HAVE THAT WOULD CHALLENGE, YOU KNOW, THEIR ULTIMATE POWER OR THEIR JOB? >> MS. RYDBERG: THANK YOU FOR ASKING THAT. I WOULD LIKE TO SAY, I HOPE THAT I AM PROFESSIONAL ENOUGH TO WHERE A LAWSUIT STAYS IN THE COURTROOM AND DOES NOT BECOME A PERSONAL VENDETTA -- I THINK YOUR WORD WAS VINDICTIVE -- I WOULD NOT LIKE TO BE PERCEIVED AS THAT TYPE OF PERSON. I COUNT THE LEE COUNTY ATTORNEY, MS. AT IN, AS A FRIEND. I THINK I WAS THE FIRST PERSON TO SERVE AS BAR PRESIDENT FOR HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY. MS. ATKIN WAS THE SECOND. SHE AND I DISCUSSED THAT POSITION AND HER POSSIBLITIES OF GETTING THERE. WE HAVE WORKED TOGETHER. AT THE END OF EACH PRESIDENT' TERM, THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO AWARD THE CARROT AWARD TO THE PERSON WHO HAS SERVED THE HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY BAR DURING THAT PRESIDENT'S TENURE MORE SIGNIFICANTLY THAN ANYBODY ELSE IN THE BAR. AND MS. ATKIN AWARDED ME WITH THAT AWARD, WHICH I CHERISH. IN FACT, I THINK I AM THE ONLY PERSON WHO HAS WON THAT AWARD THREE TIMES IN THIS BAR. SO I TREASURE HER AS A FRIEND, AS I ALSO FEEL ABOUT SEVERAL OF THE OTHER PEOPLE IN THE COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. AND I WOULD HOPE THAT WE WOULD NOT HAVE ANY PROBLEMS WORKING WITH ONE ANOTHER EITHER WAY. THANK YOU. FOR THE RECORD, I WASN'T SUGGESTING THAT YOU WERE GOING TO BE VINDICTIVE (LAUGHTER). >> MS. RYDBERG: I JUST FELT LIKE SINCE I AM ON CAMERA, I BETTER GET THAT STRAIGHT. (LAUGHTER). >> MR. WHITE? >>GERALD WHITE: MY ONLY CONCERN, YOU KNOW, I LOOK AT THE HISTORY OF THE PREVIOUS CHARTER REVIEW BOARDS, AND I THINK ONE PREVIOUS BOARD HAD AN INDEPENDENT ATTORNEY AS THEIR BOARD ATTORNEY AND NOT USING THE COUNTY ATTORNEY. MY CONCERN IS IF YOUR SERVICES WERE NEEDED, AND IT WAS SOMETHING THAT NEEDED TO GO ON THE BALLOT, WOULD IT MAKE IT TO THE BALLOT WITHOUT ANY KIND OF CHALLENGE OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT? I WANTED YOU TO TALK ABOUT YOUR CONFIDENCE IN PLACING SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT AND MAKE IT -- >> MS. RYDBERG: ONE OF THE THINGS I SAID IS, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT HAS BEEN SPECIAL IN MY CAREER IS I HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO SERVE FOR TEN YEARS AS ASSISTANT CITY ATTORNEY IN TEMPLE TERRACE. I CAN'T REMEMBER WHICH ONE OF THOSE YEARS, BUT ONE OF THOSE YEARS, THE CITY REDID ITS MUNICIPAL CHARTER. THAT HAD TO GO ON THE BALLOT. I WAS THE PERSON WHEN YOU HAVE ONLY ONE CHIEF CITY ATTORNEY AND ONE ASSISTANT CITY ATTORNEY, GUESS WHO GETS TO WRITE IT? (LAUGHTER). >> MS. RYDBERG: SO I DID MOST OF THE DRAFTING AND WORKING ON THAT WITH THE VARIOUS FOLKS WHO INPUT INTO IT. IT GOT ON THE BALLOT. IT PASSED. I AM VERY CONFIDENT. >> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS, MR. BALLARD? >>TERRY BALLARD: THE ONLY THING IS, IT WON'T AFFECT THEIR LIVELIHOOD. WE WON'T PAY Y'ALL UNTIL WE NEED Y'ALL. WE MAY HAVE TO MAKE THE DECISION AT THAT TIME IF THERE IS SOMETHING OF CONFLICT. I DON'T SEE IT AS A CONFLICT NOW, BUT LATER ON, YOU KNOW, THEY MAY GET SOME CASE THEY ARE HANDLING AND COULDN'T HANDLE IT. I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE ARE GOING TO DO AT THAT POINT IF WE SELECT ONE TONIGHT. THAT'S JUST A GENERAL COMMENT. >> THERE WILL BE A CONTRACT DRAWN UP BETWEEN THE CHARTER REVIEW BOARD, THE CHAIRMAN WILL SIGN IT, AND WHICHEVER ATTORNEY IS SELECTED. WE HAVE TWO PREVIOUS CONTRACTS THAT WE CAN REVIEW. ANY ISSUES THAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO HAVE ADDRESSED IN THAT, PERHAPS YOU CAN GET THE INFORMATION TO MS. MERRITT. THEN ONCE WE HAVE SELECTED AN ATTORNEY, ANY WORDING IN THE CONTRACT THAT YOU WANT -- >> THE POINT I WAS MAKING, ONCE THEY SIGN THIS CONTRACT, IF THEY GET A LAWSUIT, THEY HAVE TO TURN DOWN, BECAUSE WE ARE NOT PAYING THEM. IF WE WERE PAYING THEM, IT WOULD BE DIFFERENT. I WAS WONDERING HOW IT WOULD BE HANDLED. >> I THINK ANY ATTORNEYS HERE, THE COUNTY ATTORNEY AND THE TWO ATTORNEYS HERE FOR THE INTERVIEWS, WOULD CERTAINLY BE FAIR WITH US AND UPFRONT AND LET US KNOW WHETHER ANYTHING LIKE THAT HAD COME ABOUT. THERE IS NO QUESTION IN MY MIND THAT WE ARE DEALING WITH GOOD PEOPLE. MR. HURLEY? HURL HURLEY THINK IN RESPONSE TO WHAT MR. BALLARD SAID, NUMBER ONE ON THE LISTING -- AND MS. MERRITT DID YOU PUT THESE ON THE LIST OF HOW MANY PEOPLE MENTIONEDS THEM? NUMBER ONE ON THE LIST WAS COUNTY ATTORNEY ABUSE, LIMITED NUMBER OF ATTORNEYS, AND ELECTED COUNTY ATTORNEYS. SO I THINK THERE WILL BE SOME CONFLICT THAT THE COUNTY ATTORNEYS OFFICE WILL NOT BE WANTING TO DEAL WITH THAT. WHETHER THEY MAKE TWO HOURS OR TWENTY HOURS, I DON'T THINK EITHER OF THESE ATTORNEYS HAVE COME HERE WITH THE IDEA THAT THIS IS GOING TO BE THEIR RETIREMENT FUND. (LAUGHTER). >> IT MAY END UP COSTING THEM MORE THAN THE VALUE. >> LOOKING AT THE RATES, BECAUSE I HAVE A PRETTY GOOD IDEA, BECAUSE I WRITE CHECKS TO ATTORNEYS ON OCCASION, AND I THINK THAT THEY ARE PROBABLY GIVING US BARGAIN RATES ANYWAY. THOSE ARE NOT THEIR STANDARD RATES. >> ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MS. RYDBERG? IF YOU WOULDN'T MIND HAVING A SEAT, AND WE WILL CHAT WITH MR. EGGERT AND LET HIM GIVE US A BRIEF BIO ON HIMSELF AND TALK TO US ABOUT HIS ISSUES WITH THE CHARTER REVIEW BOARD. THANK YOU FOR COMING THIS EVENING. >> MR. EGGERT. I AM STU EGGERT AND I AM COUNSEL HERE IN TAMPA AND HAVE BEEN PRACTICING LAW IN THIS CITY FOR 43 YEARS. 37 OF THOSE YEARS I REPRESENTED A PUBLIC BODY. I WANTED TO YOU TO BE AWARE OF THAT. THE PUBLIC BODY IN QUESTION IS THE HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY AVIATION AUTHORITY WHICH WAS MY CLIENT FOR THOSE 37 YEARS -- A CLIENT OF THE FIRM, BUT I WAS THE ONE ASSIGNED TO THE ACCOUNT. MY FIRM IS ALLEN, DELL, FRANK AND TRINKLE, A FIRM OF APPROXIMATELY 18 LAWYERS. I CAN'T THINK OF ANY POTENTIAL CONFLICTS WE WOULD HAVE, EXCEPT I NEED TO TELL YOU THAT WE DO HAVE LITIGATION PENDING WITH THE PROPERTY APPRAISER ON BEHALF OF THE AVIATION AUTHORITY. THERE WAS A CONFLICT AS TO WHETHER OR NOT THE AVIATION AUTHORITY IS TO PAY AD VALOREM TAXES ON CERTAIN OF THEIR PROPERTIES. THE AVIATION AUTHORITY WAS CLAIMING THE STATUTORY EXEMPTION. THE PROPERTY APPRAISER HAS TAKEN THE POSITION THAT THE COURTS HAVE PRETTY MUCH DONE AWAY WITH THE EXEMPTIONS IN QUESTION, AND THAT WE WERE NOT FULLY EXEMPT, ALTHOUGH WE MAY HAVE CERTAIN EXEMPTIONS AND PRETTY MUCH WHAT WE ARE LOOKING ON NOW IS SETTLEMENTS BACK AND FORTH TO SEE IF WE CAN ARRIVE AT A CONCLUSION. BUT THERE IS THAT PENDING WITH THE PROPERTY APPRAISER. I KNOW THAT THE PROPERTY APPRAISER IS TO SOME EXTENT INDEPENDENT OF THE COUNTY COMMISSION, BUT I DID WANT YOU TO BE AWARE OF THAT POTENTIAL CONFLICT. >> THANK YOU. >> OTHER THAN THAT, I HAVE HAD A GOOD LONG TIME IN PUBLIC SERVICE REPRESENTING A PUBLIC BODY, WHICH I HAVE ENJOYED VERY MUCH. I DO NOT REPRESENT THE HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY AVIATION AUTHORITY TODAY AS THEIR GENERAL COUNCIL. I TURNED THAT GENERAL COUNCILSHIP OVER TO ONE OF MY PARTNERS JUST TWO MONTHS AGO, AND I AM KIND OF IN A SEMI RETIREMENT MODE, YOU MIGHT SAY. SO I AM ALSO NOT LOOKING FOR RETIREMENT, EITHER, WITH THE FEES STRUCTURED FOR OUR SERVICES. WE WOULD BE DELIGHTED -- MYSELF AND MY FIRM -- TO GIVE YOU BACK-UP, WHENEVER YOU NEEDED BACK-UP BECAUSE OF A CONFLICT. I FEEL LIKE WE HAVE ENOUGH EXPERIENCE IN THE AREA OF PUBLIC LAW THAT WE COULD DO A JOB FOR YOU. AND WE WOULD APPRECIATE VERY MUCH YOUR GIVING US CONSIDERATION. I WILL BE HAPPY TO TRY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE. >> MR. EGGERT, THEN YOU ARE STILL WITH YOUR FIRM. >> MR. EGGERT: YES. >> SO YOU ARE SEMI-RETIRED. >> MR. EGGERT:YES. >> WOULD YOU BE THE LEAD ATTORNEY FOR US AND THEN USE OTHER PEOPLE ON YOUR STAFF IF NECESSARY? >> MR. EGGERT:YES, THAT'S CORRECT. >> SO THERE WOULD BE PERHAPS EVEN TWO FEE SCHEDULES THERE. >> MR. EGGERT:THERE WOULD BE TWO FEE SCHEDULES FOR ANYONE ELSE ON MY STAFF, WHICH WOULD PROBABLY BE UNLIKELY, BUT IF THERE WAS, IT WOULD BE LESS THAN THE FEE SCHEDULE I HAVE GIVEN YOU FOR MYSELF. >> JAN SMITH: ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS FROM THE MEMBERS OF THE BOARD? >> MR. EGGERT, I JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY ONE MORE TIME -- YOU ARE NO LONGER THE ATTORNEY FOR THE AVIATION AUTHORITY, BUT YOU ARE IN LITIGATION STILL? >> MR. EGGERT:MY FIRM IS IN LITIGATION. >> YOUR FIRM. DO YOU HAVE AN ACTIVE PART IN THAT NOW THAT YOU ARE NO LONGER -- >> MR. EGGERT:I AM STILL A PARTNER IN THE FIRM. AND THEREFORE, I WOULD HAVE AN ACTIVE ENGAGEMENT IN ALL OF THE LITIGATION THAT WE HAVE PENDING OR ANY MATTER THAT THE FIRM REPRESENT. SO I CAN'T SAY THAT I HAVE WALKED AWAY FROM ANY LAWSUIT. I HAVE NOT. AND I AM AVAILABLE WITH REGARD TO THOSE LAWSUITS. THAT'S CORRECT. >> THANK YOU. >>GERALD WHITE: MY BIGGEST CONCERN RELATED TO THE CONFLICT ATTORNEY IS BEING ABLE TO MAKE IT WITH SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT. HAVE YOU HAD ANY EXPERIENCE IN PLACING ISSUES ON BALLOTS? >> MR. EGGERT:I HAVE HAD A LOT OF EXPERIENCE IN DRAFTING LEGISLATION AND DRAFTING EVERYTHING HAVING TO DO WITH THE AIRPORT, WHICH IS A PUBLIC BODY. AND I HAVE DONE MOST OF THAT MYSELF THROUGHOUT THE YEARS. I HAVE BEEN INVOLVED IN CONSTITUTIONAL DRAFTING AS WELL AS STATUTORY DRAFTING, SO I THINK I HAVE THE CAPABILITY OF PUTTING TOGETHER AND DRAFTING WHATEVER YOU NEED THAT WOULD BE LEGALLY UPHELD. >> MS. LASHER? >>DENISE LASHER: I HAD A QUESTION REGARDING YOUR OTHER CHARGES BESIDES YOUR HOURLY RATE. YOU DID NOT MENTION WHAT YOU WOULD CHARGE FOR A TELEPHONE, PHOTOCOPIES, TRAVEL, ET CETERA. HOW DO YOU FORESEE CHARGING FOR THOSE? IS IT GOING TO BE YOUR USUAL AND CUSTOMARY CHARGES, GOING TO BE THE ACTUAL COST, OR WHAT? >> MR. EGGERT: WHATEVER WE CHARGE YOU FOR ANY OF THAT, IF WE CHARGE YOU AT ALL, WOULD BE ACTUAL COST. >> SO IT'S NOT A PERCENTAGE OF WHATEVER YOU BILLED FOR THE MONTH IT'S AUTOMATICALLY CHARGED? >> MR. EGGERT: YES. >> OKAY. >> I HAVE A FOLLOW-UP, BECAUSE BOTH OF THESE CANADA DATES ARE TOP-NOTCH AND I'M TRYING TO FIND A WAY TO DISTINGUISH THEM. HAVE YOU SERVED IN ANY CAPACITY IN THE BAR, AS PRESIDENT OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT? >> MR. EGGERT: MANY YEARS AGO I SERVED ON THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS IN THE BAR. I HAVE NOT BEEN THAT ACTIVE IN THE BAR RECENTLY. I ATTEND. I'M IN THE SENIOR BAR, AND I MAKE ANY ATTENDANCE KNOWN IN THE SENIOR BAR. >>JAN SMITH: ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FROM BOARD MEMBERS? THANK YOU, MR. EGGERT. >> MR. EGGERT:THANK YOU VERY MUCH. >> JAN SMITH: OKAY, BOARD MEMBERS, WE CAN DO THIS ONE WAY OR ANOTHER WE CAN HAVE A MOTION TO SELECT A MEMBER, OR WE CAN GO AROUND THE TABLE AND EACH PERSON CALL THE NAME. >> START AT THE END OF THE ALPHABET? (LAUGHTER). >> I THINK SINCE WE HAVE MADE LIFE DIFFICULT FOR HER THIS EVENING, WE WILL LET HER MAKE THE DECISION. AT MR. LABOUR' SUGGESTION NOW, WE WILL START AT THE END OF THE ALPHABET. >> THANK YOU, BOARD MEMBERS. AND THANK YOU, MR. EGGERT AND MS. RYDBERG FOR COMING THIS EVENING. WE LOOK FORWARD TO WORKING WITH YOU, MS. RYDBERG, AND HOPE EITHER OF YOU, IF YOU WOULD EVEN LIKE TO COME AS A MEMBER OF THIS COMMUNITY AND WOULD LIKE TO MAKE ANY COMMENTS ABOUT HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY'S CHARTER, THAT YOU DO SO, AND WE LOOK FORWARD TO HEARING FROM YOU. >>MS. RYDBERG: I WANT TO THANK YOU AND WILL ASK FOR A SCHEDULE AND WILL TRY TO MAKE SOME OF YOUR MEETINGS, AND THEY WON'T BE ON THE METER. >> OKAY. THANK YOU. >> MS. RYDBERG, I WILL MEET WITH MY ASSISTANT OVER HERE AND MY COUNTY ATTORNEY FOR COPIES OF THE PREVIOUS CONTRACTS, AND WE WILL WORK ON MAKING ARRANGEMENTS TO GET A CONTRACT DRAWN UP AND SIGNED. ARE YOU GOING ANYWHERE? >>MS. RYDBERG: I HOPE TO HEAVEN NOT. FOR RIGHT NOW, I WILL BE HERE. >> OKAY, WE WOULD LIKE TO GET THAT ACCOMPLISHED AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. >>JOHN BALES: THAT WAS A VERY CLOSE DECISION, IN MY MIND. JUST A MOMENT, MR. EGGERT. IT WAS A CLOSE DECISION IN ALL OF OUR MINDS. SOMETIMES SOMETHING IS PERCEIVED FURTHER THAN IT IS. YOU ARE A FINE GENTLEMAN, TOO. >>JAN SMITH: THANK YOU BOTH FOR COMING THIS EVENING. >> ALL RIGHT, BOARD MEMBERS. I THINK MARSHA SORT OF SUGGESTED THAT MAYBE WE NEED TO GET OFF OF OUR DUFFS FOR A FEW MINUTES. SO LET'S TAKE A BREAK. (OFF OUR DUFFS FOR A FEW MINUTES). ^ 5MINTECHMISSING. >>MS. MERRITT: I'M CERTIFIED WITH ALL MY CODES AND CLEARANCE, TO USE THE COUNTY COMPUTERS, FINALLY. WE STILL HAVE A LITTLE PROBLEM BECAUSE IN THE OTHER BUILDING THEY ARE NOT WIRED AS WE ARE. SO SOME OF THE E-MAIL WILL COME TO THE COUNTY AND STACY WILLIAMS WILL HELP ME UNTIL WE GET ALL THE BUGS OUT OF IT. SO IF YOU SEND IT TO THE CHARTER REVIEW BOARD, CR BOARD AT HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY.ORG, I WILL GET IT. I BEGAN WORKING IMMEDIATELY AND I COLLECTED ALL SEVEN HOME RULE CHARTERS WITH THE STATE OF FLORIDA. WITH THE MAIL-OUT PACKET WE TRIED TO PICK THE LARGE URBAN COUNTIES THAT WE HAD THE INFORMATION FOR, SO YOU COULD COMPARE APPLES AND APPLES AND THE DIFFERENT TRANSPORTATION NEEDS, THAT TYPE OF THING. I HAVE PULLED AND SO FAR CONFIRMED -- MR. BELDEN SPOKE TO YOU TONIGHT. MR. CLAIMON WILL BE HERE THE NEXT MEETING, AND THE SUPERVISOR ELECTIONS WILL BE HERE. BOB TURNER WILL BE HERE. SHERIFF SAID HE WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK TO THE BOARD SOMETIME IN JULY. I HAVE TALKED TO ALL THE COMMISSIONERS, AND ALL THE COMMISSIONERS HAVE CONFIRMED DAILTS EXCEPT FOR COMMISSIONER SCOTT AND COMMISSIONER NORMAN SAID THANK YOU FOR THE INVITATION BUT HE CHOSE NOT TO ADDRESS THE BOARD. THE LEGISLATIVE DELEGATION MEMBERS, I HAVE DRIVEN THEM CRAZY ALSO. THEY ASKED ME TO WAIT FOR SESSION NEXT WEEK AND THEY WOULD ALL BE GLAD TO COME AND GIVE YOU TIME. I AM EXCITED, ON THURSDAY, MAY 11, THE COUNTY IS HAVING A TOWN HALL MEETING. THEY HAVE INVITED US TO PARTICIPATE. IT IS IN SUN CITY CENTER. SO I HAVE ASKED BOARD MEMBER DEE WILLIAMS TO COME OUT AND HELP ME, PASS OUT ALL THE CHARTERS AND QUESTIONNAIRES, AND I GET TO DRIVE HER CRAZY THAT DAY. TO RECAP SOME OF THE THINGS WE HAVE DONE, WE SET UP THE OFFICE, WHICH WAS KIND OF FUNNY BECAUSE THE OFFICE WAS DESIGNATED FOR SOMEBODY ELSE. I WENT ONE DAY, THOUGHT WE HAD FURNITURE, WENT THE NEXT DAY, THE FURNITURE WAS OUT OF THERE. COMEDY OF ERRORS THAT WE GOT STRAIGHTENED OUT. WE HAVE A PRINTER, FILE CABINET, PHONE NETWORK, DESK, WE ARE WIRED! I AM TRYING TO ESTABLISH THE SPEAKER CALENDAR. DR. MCMANUS HAS ALSO AGREED TO SPEAK TO US IN JULY. PROFESSOR WILL JOSEPH, I COULD NOT GET ^ NAME HOLD OF HIM, BUT HIS WIFE WAS IN THE BUSINESS AND I TRACKED HER DOWN SO I GOT A PERSONAL NOTE TO HIM TODAY. THE BUDGET AND INFORMATION CODES WERE SET UP SO WE HAVE OUR BUDGET AND WE ARE READY TO GO THERE. WE HAVE A QUESTIONNAIRE, AND A PUBLIC COMMENT CARD. THE PUBLIC COMMENT CARDS ARE IN THE PROCESS OF BEING PRINTED NOW. BUSINESS CARDS ARE BEING PRINTED. WHAT I DID IS, IT'S JUST A PLAIN CARD AND IT HAS ROOM FOR YOU TO SIGN YOUR NAME AND HAS THE CHARTER REVIEW BOARD, MY NAME, TELEPHONE NUMBER, ADDRESS ON THERE. I DIDN'T ORDER INDIVIDUAL CARDS BECAUSE I THOUGHT THESE COULD BE USED BY ALL THE BOARD MEMBERS AND I ORDERED ONE THOUSAND AND IT COST $20. I STARTED MY RESEARCH, AND CORRESPONDENCE FILES. ALL THE PERSONNEL PAPERWORK I HAD TO COMPLETE HAS BEEN DONE, IN HUMAN RESOURCES. I HAVE BEEN WORKING WITH THE COMMUNICATIONS DEPARTMENT WITH THE WEBSITE AND GETTING ALL THE INFORMATION WE NEED FOR A PUBLIC AWARENESS THAT WE ARE MEETING AND WHERE WE ARE MEETING, AND I WILL HAVE THAT ON THE WEBSITE AS WELL, AS IN THE PUBLIC OFFICE DOWNSTAIRS WHICH EVERYBODY KNOWS. I HAVE BEEN WORKING WITH NEWS RELEASES IN THE LAST TWO WEEKS, IN LA GAZETTEA AND THE BRAND NEWS. I'M SORRY, I GET THEM MIXED UP, DO YOU THINK IN THE SUN CITY CENTER, IS IT THE SUN OR THE OBSERVER? >> BOTH. >> WE WERE IN THE SUN ONE WEEK AND WE WILL BE IN THE OBSERVER NEXT WEEK. I WILL CONTINUED WITH THE NEWS RELEASES. WHAT I DID, BECAUSE I HAVE A BETTER WAY OF FAXING FROM HOME, I CAN PUT IT ON AUTOMATIC PILOT BECAUSE I CAN PROGRAM IT INTO MY COMPUTER. I SIGNED OUT 47 NEWS RELEASES SO ALL THE NEWS MEDIA, TELEVISION, RADIO, PRINTS MEDIA, ALL KNOW WE ARE MEETING, HAVE A SCHEDULE OF WHEN WE ARE MEET, THEY HAVE TELEVISION NUMBERS OF WHERE TO CALL US. NEXT THING I DID WAS PREPARE THE DISCUSSION LIST. I RECEIVED 7 LISTS TODAY. WHAT I DID, IT'S IN YOUR PACKETS -- THERE WAS MENTION OF ELECTED COUNTY ATTORNEY -- -- -- BUDGET PROACTIVE BY THE B BOCC, COUNTY FINANCE PERSON TO WORK WITH THE BOCC, UNDER DIRECTION OF BOCC. ANOTHER WAS THE STATUS OF CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS, TERM LIMIT, VERSUS APPOINTED OFFICERS, ADDING MORE DISTRICTS, ELIMINATING AT-LARGE SEATS, CHANGING THE OATH OF OFFICE TO UP HOLD THE CHARTER, ANOTHER WAS INDEXING OR ELIMINATING TAXES -- TO REMOVE TAXES OR FEES SHOULD REQUIRE A MAJORITY VOTE. THE LEAGUE OF WOMEN VOTERS, THEY ARE STIT WAITING. THE NATIONAL CIVIC LEAGUE I DO HAVE A LIST -- WE HAVE 22 LIBRARY SITES. I TALKED TO THE DIFFERENT LIBRARIES TO PUT DROP BOXES THERE. IT HAS TRADITIONALLY NOT BEEN A SUCCESSFUL MEASURE. I DIDN'T INVESTIGATE THE COST OF DROP BOXES YET BECAUSE I DIDN'T HAVE A CHANCE. BUT I DO HAVE A LIST OF THE LIBRARY SERVICES. THEY ARE WILLING TO HELP US EVEN WITH THE WEBSITE TO MAKE PEOPLE ACQUAINTED WITH THOSE. THE QUESTIONNAIRES, IT WAS IN YOUR BOARD PACKET, LOOKS LIKE THIS. WE WILL GET THAT PRINTED UP. CHAIRMAN SMITH, WHAT I DID IS, I MADE IT SMALLER. IT WILL BE A CARD, CAN BE FOLDED IN HALF. ON THIS SIDE WILL BE THE ADDRESS TO COME BACK TO THE COUNTY, SO WE WILL GET TWO ON ONE. SO OUT OF 500, WE WILL HAVE A THOUSAND. THOSE WE CAN DO DIFFERENT THINGS WITH. I SPOKE WITH THE COMMUNICATIONS DEPARTMENT. THEY HAVE SOME IDEAS OF WHERE WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO PUT SOME OF THE QUESTIONNAIRES INTO THE UTILITY BILLS. THEY HAVE DIFFERENT NEWSLETTERS GOING OUT. I WILL HAVE TO LOOK AT THE WEIGHT OF PAPER THEY WILL REQUIRE ON THAT TYPE OF THING AND WILL GET BACK WITH YOU IN TWO WEEKS AND I DIDN'T KNOW IF YOU HAD ANY OTHER QUESTIONS. >>JAN SMITH: I MUST TELL YOU THAT INITIALLY WE HAD ANTICIPATED THAT BARBARA SPEND ABOUT 20 HOURS A WEEK WORKING AND THE FIRST TWO WEEKS HAVE BEEN AT LEAST 30 HOURS A WEEK JUST GETTING SET UP WAS DIFFICULTY, AND SHE WAS REQUIRED BY THE COUNTY TO TAKE SOME OF THEIR COURSES, A COUPLE-HOURS COURSE TO USE THE E-MAIL SO SHE HAS ACCOMPLISHED THAT. BUT I HAVE ALSO ASKED HER TO DO A LOT OF DIGGING BASED ON EARLIER COMMENTS I HEARD FROM THE BOARD. ONE OF THE LISTS THAT SHOULD HAVE COME TO YOU IS LISTS FROM THE PARTY, WHETHER THEY ARE PARTISAN, NON-PARTISAN, SHOULD BE ESTABLISHED IN YOUR BOOK. THERE ARE OTHER THINGS WE ARE WORKING ON. IF ANY OF YOU HAVE ANY CONCERN AS TO THE AMOUNT OF TIME SHE SPENT, SHE IS KEEPING A DETAILED LOG AND SUBMITTING THAT TO ME, AND OTHER THAN THAT, SHE SENDS IT INTO THE COUNTY AFTER I SIGN IT FOR HER PAYMENT FOR SERVICES. I THINK SHE'S DONE AN EXCELLENT JOB RESEARCHING. SO FAR, I EXPECT HER TO CONTINUE. I DID WANT TO TELL YOU THAT ONE OF THE PREVIOUS ASSISTANTS FOR CHARTER REVIEW BOARD, GARY SHEPHERD, FROM THE ONE IN 1991, CONTACTEDED ME, AND ALSO VOLUNTEERED ANY ASSISTANCE HE COULD GIVE US, AND SAID HE WOULD GIVE US HELP ON SOME THINGS. SO WE WILL GET SOME HELP FROM HIM. HE ALSO WILL BE WRITING STORIES IN VARIOUS MAGAZINES HE'S ASSOCIATED WITH. IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS, WE HAVE PHONE NUMBERS, FAX MACHINES, E-MAILS, SO WE OUGHT TO BE ABLE TO STAY IN TOUCH WITH BARBARA. >> BARBARA: BEING A CITIZEN ACTIVIST IN MY PRIOR LIFE, I KIND OF KNEW WHERE THINGS WERE BUT I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND A LOT OF THE WAY THINGS WORKED. SO I AM GETTING THE WRINKLES OUT OF THAT AND I PROMISE IF WE CHANGE THE BOARD ROOM AGAIN I WILL LET YOU ALL KNOW. AND THANK YOU, SUE. I DO WANT TO KNOW WHAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO PROCEED, LIKE WITH THE NEXT MEETING, TO GET SOME MORE BOARD DISCUSSION, IF YOU NEED ANY MORE BACK-UP AND HOW YOU WOULD LIKE TO GO THERE. >>JAN SMITH: MY INTENT IS TO MEET WITH BARBARA THE DAY AFTER EACH MEETING, TO RECAP, SEE WHAT WE DID OR DIDN'T DO, TO GO BACK AND REMEMBER WHAT ISSUES YOU HAVE RAISED AND HAS INFORMATION WE CAN GET TO ANSWER YOUR CONCERNS, SO SHE AND I WILL BE DOING THAT AFTER EACH MEETING. IF THERE IS SOMETHING SPECIFIC THAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO REQUEST, PLEASE CONTACT HER AT ANY OF THE WAYS OF COMMUNICATING THAT YOU CHOOSE. WE HAVE A LOT TO LEARN AND A LOT TO CONSIDER. SO IF YOU HAVE SOMETHING THAT YOU PARTICULARLY WANT DISCUSSED, PLEASE GET THE INFORMATION AND REQUEST TO BARBARA SO THAT WE CAN LOOK AT IT. >>BARBARA MERRITT: ONE OTHER THING, I WILL SEND THE LIST AROUND. IF YOU HAVE A CHANGE OF E-MAIL, THE CLERKS -- RIGHT NOW WE ARE GOING INTO BUTT TIME AND THE COUNTY COMMISSION HAD A FEW MEETINGS WITH TAMPA GENERAL EMERGENCY SO WE WON'T GET THE MINUTES AS FAST AS WE'D LIKE TO BUT WITH E-MAIL WE GET THEM QUICKER. I HAVE FAX NUMBERS ON HERE. I THINK I REACHED 10 OR 11 OF YOU BY FAX. I KNOW IT'S KIND OF HARD, AND I WILL DO EVERYTHING I CAN TO GET THEM OUT. THE OTHER THING IS THE COMMUNICATIONS DEPARTMENT SAID IF WE HAD A PACKET WE NEEDED TO GO OUT IMMEDIATELY, THEY WOULD MAKE THE COURIER SERVICE AVAILABLE. THEY HAVE IN-HOUSE COURIERS HERE. I DIDN'T KNOW THAT UNTIL TODAY. >>JAN SMITH: WE ALSO KNOW HOW THE COUNTY DOES MAILINGS SO WE INTEND TO MAIL THINGS AT LEAST TEN DAYS IN ADVANCE OF THE MEETING SO THAT IS SOMETHING THAT WE LEARNED THAT CHANGED OUR MODUS OPERANDI. >> I WANT TO TELL YOU THAT I HAVE HAD SOME THOUGHTS AND TALKED TO SOME PEOPLE ABOUT A WAY THAT WE COULD HAVE A MEETING THAT WOULD BE SOMEWHAT LESS FORMAL, BUT WOULD BE DIFFERENT FROM WHAT -- THE WAY THAT I HAD PARTICIPATED IN PREVIOUS CHARTERS. THE CITIZENS GROUPS, I DID TELL YOU I HAD A LETTER FROM TOM JONES OUT IN CARROLLWOOD AND SOME OF THOSE CITIZENS GROUPS WOULD LIKE TO HAVE A LONGER OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK TO US. I TALKED TO A COUPLE OF FACILITATORS AND HAVE THOUGHT THAT IT MIGHT BE MORE CONSTRUCTIVE IF WE HAD A ROUND TABLE-TYPE OF A MEETING, AND INCLUDED IN THAT MEETING OR DIVIDED IF MEETING, HOWEVER IT WORKS OUT. AS I SAID, I HAVE NOT FIRMED IT UP IN MY MIND YET, BUT TO INVITE THE BUSINESS COMMUNITIES, THE HOMEBUILDERS, THE DEVELOPERS, ANY BUSINESS ENTITY THAT IS INVOLVED WITH COUNTY GOVERNMENT, TO A MEETING. ALSO TO INVITE THE CIVIC GROUPS. AND TO HAVE A FACILITATOR HERE TO LET THESE PEOPLE SPEAK AND TO GET A DIALOGUE GOING, RATHER THAN THE FORMAL WAY THAT OUR MEETINGS PROCEED HERE. I DON'T KNOW YET WHETHER THAT'S GOING TO COME ABOUT. I KIND OF WANT TO HEAR FROM YOU ALL AS TO WHETHER YOU THINK THAT'S SOMETHING THAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO DO. >>TERRY BALLARD: I WOULD JUST LIKE TO GO BACK TO THE PHILOSOPHY OF, YOU KNOW, WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO, AND HOW WE ARE GOING TO DO IT. I WAS LOOKING OVER THE LIST, AND I SENT MY LIST. I WAS ONE OF THE ONES. I WAS THE 7TH. I THOUGHT THAT MOST EVERYBODY WAS GOING TO SEND BACK A LIST. AND WE COULD LOOK AT THE AREAS, AND LABEL MINE AREAS OF INTEREST. I HEARD PEOPLE SAY SEVERAL THINGS ABOUT THINGS NEEGD TO BE FIXED. LIKE ABOUT THE QUALIFICATIONS. ONCE I MAILED IT IN, I KNOW IT'S PUBLIC RECORDS; ANYBODY CAN LOOK AT IT. I DON'T MIND HAVING UP HERE LIKE THE QUALIFICATIONS OF COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR, IS THAT 7 OUT OF 7? YOU KNOW, THE ISSUES THAT WE WANT TO FOCUS ON. IT IS GOOD TO HAVE EVERYBODY COME TALK TO US. BUT WHAT WILL HAPPEN IS, AFTER EVERYBODY HAS TALKED TO US, WE HAVE SERVED A YEAR AND WE ARE GONE. SO WE NEED TO FOCUS ON SOME ISSUES! >> I AGREE WITH YOU. >> I AGREE WITH YOU. >> THAT'S MY WAY OF LOOKING AT IT. >>JAN SMITH: THAT'S WHY I HAD HOPED TO HAVE ALL OF THE LISTS BY THIS MEETINGS. SO BASED ON THE FACT THAT I DON'T HAVE EVERYONE'S LIST, BUT I AM NOT SO SURE THAT THE LIST, FROM WHAT I HAVE SEEN, OF THE 7 OR 8 THAT ARE IN, ARE GOING TO BE THAT DIFFERENT. WHAT I HAD HOPED TO DO AT THE SECOND HALF OF EACH MEETING IS TO PICK FROM THAT PRIORITY LIST -- IT WOULD COME OUT ON YOUR AGENDA -- ON THAT PRIORITY LIST, WHAT ARE THE THINGST TWO ISSUES PERHAPS, THAT WE WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS IN THE SECOND HALF OF THE MEETINGS, WEIGHS PROCEED? SO THE FIRST HALF, WE WOULD KIND OF LISTEN TO THE PUBLIC, LISTEN TO INVITED SPEAKERS. THE SECOND HALF WE WOULD FOCUS ON CERTAIN ISSUES, AND I AM ALSO TRYING TO RELATE THOSE ISSUES TO WHO HAS BEEN HERE, WHO HAS SPOKEN, WHAT HAVE WE TALKED ABOUT. SO IT WAS KIND OF MY INTENT TO TRY TO START THAT, HOPEFULLY AT THE NEXT MEETING. BUT -- >> I JUST HAVE ONE COMMENT ON THAT. IT KIND OF SEEMS BACKWARDS TO ME THAT, FOR US TO BE PRODUCTIVE IN THE LIMITED TIME WE HAVE, IF YOU SET THE FIRST PART OF THE MEETING TO ADDRESS AN ISSUE AND OPEN IT UP FOR A DIALOGUE AND THAT'S ANNOUNCED IN ADD VAVENS THAT THAT IS THE ISSUE YOU WILL BE ADDRESSING, THEN YOU HAVE YOUR SPEAKERS HERE TO PROVIDE US INPUT ON THE ISSUE THAT THEY ARE THERE TO TAKE UP. >> IT WOULD BE NICE IF IT WORKED THAT WAY, BUT IT'S VERY DIFFICULT TO GET PEOPLE WHO WORK ALL DAY, WHETHER IT'S IN COUNTY GOVERNMENT, OR WHOEVER IT IS THAT WE ARE ASKING TO COME HERE, TO GET THEIR SCHEDULES ALIGNED WITH US, SO IT IS REALLY BEING DONE BACKWARDS. >> EVEN IF YOU LET THE SPEAKERS GO FIRST, IF IT'S PREANNOUNCED THAT ON THIS PARTICULAR MEETING WE'RE GOING TO BE DISCUSSING X ISSUE, THE FOLKS THAT ARE COMING OUT TO SPEAK FIRST AT THE BEGINNING OF THE MEETING WILL UNDERSTAND THAT THAT'S KIND OF THE DIRECTION WE ARE GOING, RATHER THAN BEING ALL OVER THE MAP AND HEARING PEOPLE TALK ABOUT ALL TOPICS THAT ARE OF IMPORTANCE TO THEM. WE SHOULD BE INVITING THE FOLKS AND ENCOURAGING ANY GROUPS THAT ARE INTERESTED IN THAT PARTICULAR ISSUE, WHICH IS THE TOPIC FOR THAT NIGHT'S MEETING, TO SHARE THEIR THOUGHTS WITH US. THEN, IN GROUP DISCUSSION IN THE SECOND HALF OF THE MEETING, WE HAVE THE BENEFIT OF ALL THAT INPUT AND WE CAN FOCUS ON TRYING TO GET SOMETHING DEFINITIVE DONE ON THAT ISSUE. >> AND I THINK THAT'S REALLY WHAT BARBARA AND I HAVE TALKED ABOUT AND WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO SET UP. BUT I DO THINK THAT PROBABLY ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE NEED TO DISCUSS IS WHETHER OR NOT -- AND IT'S AN ISSUE THAT I BELIEVE WE SHOULD TRY TO CONSIDER SOON AND VOTE UP AND DOWN -- ARE WE IN THE MODE OF PUTTING SOMETHING OPT CHARTER IMMEDIATELY -- ON THE CHARTER IMMEDIATELY FOR THIS YEAR? OR ARE WE GOING TO FOLLOW THE WORDS OF THE CHATTER, THAT YOU DO A COMPREHENSIVE STUDY OF COUNTY GOVERNMENT AND MAKE A RECOMMENDATION? YOU CAN DO IT, ACCORDING TO THE COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, IN TWO SEPARATE PIECES OR ALL IN ONE. SO I THINK THAT'S A DECISION THAT THIS BOARD NEEDS TO COME TO AND PROBABLY QUICKLY, SO THAT WE KNOW HOW TO PROCEED WITH THE PRIORITY LIST AND WHO'S COMING AND HOW WE ARE GOING TO CAST OUR VOTES, IN SOME KIND OF A PLAN OF ATTACK, SO THAT THINGS ARE LINKED. MR. HURLEY? >> MR. HURLEY: I KNOW IN OUR STUDY OF COUNTY GOVERNMENT, I KNOW LAST YEAR WHEN I SERVED ON THE BLUE RIBBON COMMITTEE, GERALD, MS. LASHER AND I SERVED TON COMMITTEE FOR 3 YEARS. MS. TUTTLE, DEE WILLIAMS, I BELIEVE ARE THE ONLY TWO PREVIOUS CHAERLT REVIEW MEETINGS. MR. LABOUR HAS BEEN INVOLVED IN A LOT OF POLITICAL ACTIVITY AND THINGS AROUND THE COUNTRY. MR. AMBLER WAS INVOLVED. EVERYONE WHO WAS APPOINTED WAS APPOINTED BECAUSE OF THEIR KNOWLEDGE AND THEIR RELATIONSHIP TO THE COUNTY. SO I THINK STUDYING IT DOESN'T MEAN WE SQUARE OFF WITH ZERO. START OAF WITH SQUARE ZERO -- WE ARE NOT PLEEBS. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE NEXT THING ON THE LIST, COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR IS ON TAP TO SPEAK TO US NEXT MEETING. SO WE CAN GO AHEAD AND ATTACK THAT PARTICULAR ISSUE. IT SEEMS APPROPRIATE FOR TIMING. AND IF WE GET SOMETHING READY TO GO, THEN WE CAN PUT IT ON THE BALLOT. I MEAN I DON'T WANT TO SAY, WE HAVE TO PUT SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT RIGHT NOW. I DON'T WANT THAT TO BE OUR FOCUS. IF WE COME UP WITH SOMETHING THAT WE CAN PUT ON THE BALLOT, THEN WE DO IT. I WOULD RATHER DO THAT THAN HAVE A MANDATE TO OURSELVES THAT WE HAVE TO GO ON THE BALLOT THIS TIME. >>STEVE LABOUR: I CERTAINLY HAVEN'T BEEN SHY ABOUT MY OPINION. FOR THE RECORD I WILL NOT BE SUBMITTING A LIST SO DON'T WAIT FOR IT. IT WON'T BE COMING. IT WILL BE COMING, THOUGH, AT AN APPROPRIATE TIME. AGAIN I REMIND THE BOARD, WHILE I CERTAINLY KNOW THAT THESE ARE PROBABLY ISSUES THAT WE ARE GOING TO TALK ABOUT, WE HAVE HEARD FROM A DOZEN PEOPLE -- -- LESS THAN A DOZEN PEOPLE. I AM CONCERNED -- AND MR. AMBLER, CERTAINLY THERE IS ONE PROCESS IN WHICH YOU CAN SAY HERE ARE THE TWO ISSUES WE ARE GOING TO TALK ABOUT TONIGHT, AND EVERYBODY IS HERE TONIGHT, WILL YOU PLEASE COME AND TALK ABOUT THOSE ISSUES? THAT IS ONE WAY OF DOING IT. I DON'T THINK THAT IS THE MOST OPEN WAY OF DOING IT. I THINK WE CANNOT LIMIT THE DISCUSSION TO THE ISSUES WE CHOOSE, THAT WE HAVE PRIORITIZED, WITHOUT HEARING FROM MORE PEOPLE. AND I KNOW I WILL LOSE ON THIS ISSUE BECAUSE IT HAS BEEN CLEAR THAT I DON'T HAVE THE MAJORITY OF FOLKS BEHIND ME ON THIS, OF HOLDING BACK THE LIST FOR A COUPLE MORE MONTHS. THEREFORE, I THINK IT IS VERY IMPORTANT THAT WE HAVE THIS CITIZENS MEETING IN JUNE. I WILL BE CANDID WITH YOU, DAN CLAIMON COMING TO TALK ABOUT THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR WILL NOT GIVE US ENLIGHTENED INFORMATION ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT THERE SHOULD BE ANY REQUIREMENTS IN THE CHARTER. HE'S NOT GOING TO TELL US THAT. BUT I BELT YOU SOMEBODY FROM THE NATIONAL CIVIC LEAGUE WHO LAST HAD YEARS OF EXPERIENCE WITH THIS COULD COME AND TELL US, AND HELP US WRESTLE WITH SOME OF THESE ISSUES. PEOPLE WHO ARE OUTSIDE THE ELECTED OFFICIALS WHO ARE MINDFUL OF THE CAMERA THAT IS FACING THEM AS TO WHAT THEY CAN OR CAN'T SAY. ONE GROUP THAT IS NOT SHY IS SILT SENSE. THEY ARE NOT COMING OUT BECAUSE WE HAVEN'T INVITED THEM. THAT'S WHY I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE A MEETING IN WHICH WE CONTACT SPECIFICALLY THE CIVIC LEADERS OF THIS COUNTY AND THIS CITY, AND WE PROMO IT AND HAVE THEM COME DOWN AND KEEP IT OPEN. IF THEY WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE ZONING PROCESS BEING HORRID, THEN WE NEED TO LISTEN. LET'S NOT JUST SAY, LET'S STICK TO THE TWO ISSUES ON THE SHEET. THAT'S WHAT WE ARE REALLY INTERESTED. BECAUSE THOSE WEREN'T PRIORITIZED BASED ON ONLY WHAT SOME PEOPLE AROUND THIS TABLE DECIDED THEY WANTED TO PUT TON LIST. WE HAVE TO HAVE THE TRUST OF THESE CITIZENS IF WE PUT ANYTHING ON THE BALLOT IN NOVEMBER OR CERTAINLY IN 2001 AND/OR BOTH. AND I AM JUST CONCERNED THAT SOME PEOPLE ARE GOING TO -- THERE WAS A REMARK THAT WAS MADE LAST MONTH, AND IT TROUBLED ME LATER AFTER I THOUGHT BIT, THAT SOMEONE -- AND IT'S NOTHING PERSONAL, FROM THE PERSON WHO MADE IT, BUT THEY WERE ACCUSING ME, SAYING IF YOU DON'T NOTICE WHAT THE ISSUES ARE NOW, STEVE, THEN YOU WILL NEVER KNOW WHAT THE ISSUES ARE. WELL, I KNOW THESE ISSUES HAVE BEEN DEBATED IN THE PAST BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S ON THOSE PEOPLE'S MINDS NOW, TODAY. I'M SORRY, BUT LESS THAN A DOZEN PEOPLE STANDING IN FRONT OF THAT PODIUM HAINTD GIVEN ME ANY BETTER FEELING ABOUT WHAT PEOPLE THINK ABOUT THESE ISSUES ON THIS STREET. SO I DON'T KNOW WHY WE ARE BEING VERY QUICK TO SUDDENLY COME UP WITH A STRATEGY, AND LET'S QUICK TALK ABOUT ISSUES, BECAUSE I DON'T THINK WE HAVE GONE FAR ENOUGH. OUR EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR HAS JUST BEEN WITH US FOR THREE WEEKS. SO I WON'T BORE YOU AGAIN. THAT'S MY SPEECH. IT'S MY STANDARD SPEECH. I KNOW I'M IN THE MINORITY, BUT I WOULD AT LEAST ASK THIS BODY TO CONSIDER HAVING THE JUNE 1ST MEETING, A CALL TO OUR CIVIC LEADERS AND CITIZENS TO COME DOWN AND HAVE AN OPEN DISCUSSION WITH US ABOUT THE CHARTER. >>DENISE LASHER: I THINK YOU HAVE MADE SOME EXCELLENT POINTS, AND I AGREE THAT WHEN YOU INVITE ELECTED OFFICIALS AND PROBABLY COUNTY STAFF DOWN HERE, WE ALL PRETTY MUCH KNOW WHAT THEIR OPINIONS ARE ON SOME OF THESE ISSUES. IF YOU ASK THE CLERK'S OFFICE SHOULD WE DO AWAY WITH HIS OFFICE OR DIVIDE UP HIS POWERS, HE'S GOING TO SAY NO. IF YOU ASK THE BUDGET DEPARTMENT OR AUDIT DEPARTMENT, YOU KNOW, ED HUNSzINGER, SHOULD WE HAVE ANOTHER MEMBER APPOINTED TO THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS? OF COURSE NOT, BECAUSE THEY FEEL THEY ARE DOING A GREAT JOB ALREADY. SO I THINK THERE IS SOME VALUE IN HEARING FROM PEOPLE OUTSIDE OF THE SYSTEM, AND I AGREE THAT IT'S VERY IMPORTANT THAT WE GET INPUT FROM CITIZENS, AND I WOULD AGREE WITH YOU, THAT PERHAPS JUNE 1ST OR THE FIRST MEETING IN JUNE WOULD BE AN EXCELLENT TIME TO SET UP SUCH A MEETING. I KNOW THAT WE TALKED ABOUT THIS EXTENSIVELY, OR AT LEAST I THINK WE DID AT THE END OF THE LAST MEETING. HOW WILL WE PROCEED FROM THIS POINT FORWARD? AND THERE SEEMED TO BE SOME CONSENSUS THAT WE WANTED TO TRY TO FOCUS ON A COUPLE OF KEY ISSUES, OR ONE OR TWO ISSUES TO SEE IF THERE WAS SOMETHING FROM OUR DISCUSSIONS THAT POTENTIALLY COULD GO ON THE BALLOT. WE WANTED AN OPINION FROM THE COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, COULD WE HAVE SOME BALLOT ISSUES THIS ELECTION AND THEN CONTINUE DELIBERATING AND POTENTIALLY PUT SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT IN THE NEXT GENERAL ELECTION IN 02? IT APPEARS WE COULD DO THAT. I THINK WE COULD SATISFY EVERYBODY'S INTERESTS AND CONCERNS IN PROCEEDING WITH GETTING SOME CITIZEN INPUT RIGHT AWAY, AND THEN TRYING TO COME UP WITH A COUPLE OF TOPICS, COUPLE OF ISSUES, THAT WE THINK WARRANT DISCUSSION IMMEDIATELY, THAT WE COULD DEBATE THOSE, GET SOME ADDITIONAL INPUT FROM CONCERNED PARTIES, AND THEN SEE IF WE CAN COME UP WITH ENOUGH VOTES TO PUT THAT, IF WE FEEL LIKE IT'S WARRANTED, TO PUT SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT THIS TIME, AND CONTINUE TO TAKE PUBLIC COMMENT AND HAVE SPEAKERS COME IN AND LOOK AT PUTTING SOME OTHER ISSUES POTENTIALLY ON THE BALLOT. I THINK WE CAN DO ALL OF THOSE THINGS, BUT WE ARE GOING TO RUN OUT OF TIME. CONSENSUS LAST TIME WAS FOR US TO GO AHEAD AND GET TO WORK. >> THE MAJORITY WAS. I'M NOT SURE WHAT CONSENSUS WAS. >> THE MAJORITY. OY USED THE WRONG TERM. I DON'T KNOW THAT WE TOOK A VOTE. THE MINUTES DON'T SHOW WE TOOK A VOTE BECAUSE I'M NOT SURE WE COULD DO THAT. WE NEEDED TO GET A LEGAL OPINION FIRST. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE US TAKE A VOTE TONIGHT, WHETHER WE WANT TO DO THAT, WHETHER WE WANT TO HAVE SOME SET PROCESS IN PLACE, AND THE PROPOSAL I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE IS THAT WE GET COMMENTS RIGHT AWAY FROM THE PUBLIC. SOMEHOW LET THEM KNOW THAT WE NEED TO HEAR FROM THEM IMMEDIATELY WHAT THEIR CONCERNS AND ISSUES ARE, AND THEN DELIBERATE ON THAT AS A GROUP AND SAY, HERE'S TWO OR THREE POINTS THAT WE WANT TO CONSIDER IMMEDIATELY WITH THE POTENTIAL OF PUTTING SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT THIS FALL. AND THEN PROCEED FROM THERE. AND I THINK WE CAN ACCOMPLISH EVERYBODY'S INTERESTS PRETTY MUCH. THANK YOU. >> WE HAVE SOME TENTATIVE PEOPLE ON JUNE 1ST, BUT REMEMBER THE POSSIBILITY OF A ROUND-TABLE IS SOMETHING THAT WE COULD EVEN ADD A MEETING AND DO THAT IF NECESSARY, OR WE MAY STILL HAVE TIME ON THE JUNE 1ST AGENDA TO HAVE AN OPEN FORUM, AND IT MAY HAVE TO BE THAT WE DO IT WITH ALL THE INTERESTS AT ONCE AS OPPOSED TO JUST THE DIFFERENT GROUPS MAKING HALF-HOUR PRESENTATIONS. BUT ALSO REMEMBER I SUGGESTED WE MAYBE TAKE SOME STRAW VOTES, WHICH IS WHY, AS MUCH AS MY ESTEEMED COLLEAGUE MR. LABOUR ISN'T CRAZY ABOUT THE LIST, I THOUGHT HAVING THAT LIST WOULD GIVE US AN OPPORTUNITY TO TAKE A STRAW VOTE ON THE ISSUES THAT WE MAY OR MAY NOT WANT TO DISCUSS -- ISSUES THAT WE CAN PRIORITIZE OR IT MAY BE SOMETHING THAT WOULD GO ON ONE BALLOT OR ANOTHER. SO I THINK THERE'S GOOD INPUT CERTAINLY FROM EVERYONE ON THIS ISSUE AND HOW WE'RE GOING TO RESOLVE IT, AND THERE ARE SOME SPEAKERS FROM OUTSIDE THIS COUNTY -- AND I THINK THAT'S ALSO IMPORTANT -- WE HAVE OTHER FORMS OF GOVERNMENT FROM OTHER PLACES IN THE STATE OF THAT THAT MAY HAVE DONE THINGS A LITTLE DIFFERENTLY THAN WE HAVE, THAT MAY IN FACT PLAY INTO WHAT OUR DECISION-MAKING PROCESS MAY BE. I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD PRECLUDE OURSELVES FROM LISTENING AND HEARING, AND CERTAINLY WE HAVE A YEAR OR WE HAVE TWO MONTHS. REMEMBER IF WE ARE GOING TO PUT SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT, IT'S GOING TO HAVE TO BE INTO THE JUSTICE BY SOMETIME IN JULY TO GET IT CLEARED. SO WE WILL HAVE TO BRING THIS DISCUSSION TO A HALT, WHICH I REALLY WHAT I INTENDED TO DO OVER THE NEXT WEEK OR SO SO WE CAN LINE UP HOW TO PROCEED BUT WE CAN'T PROCEED UNTIL WE HEAR FROM SOME OF THE PEOPLE AS TO HOW WE WANT TO PROCEED. MR. WHITE YOU ARE NEXT. THEN MARY LOU TUTTLE, THEN MR. BALLARD AND MS. WILLIAMS. >>GERALD WHITE: STEVE, I TOO HAVE BEEN THINKING A GREAT DEAL ABOUT YOUR COMMENTS THAT YOU MADE AT LAST MEETING AND THE MEETING BEFORE, AND I CONSIDER YOU TO BE A WISE MAN, AND SO I HAVE BEEN GIVEN YOUR CONCERN -- HAVE BEEN GIVING YOUR CONCERN A GREAT DEAL OF THOUGHT. WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE RESPONSIBILITY THAT WE HAVE RELATED THIS CHARTER, IT IS VERY SERIOUS, THE NEXT STEP, WHAT WE DECIDE TO DO AS A BODY. BUT, YOU KNOW, I HAVE A DESIRE TO SERVE ON THIS CHARTER REVIEW BOARD, I DID, LONG BEFORE I WAS APPOINTED. IN THAT REGARD, I HAVE BEEN DOING A GREAT DEAL OF STUDY, AND I HAVE BEEN MEETING QUITE A WHILE IN THE COMMUNITY WITH ALL SORTS OF CITIZENS, AND THE ELDERS OF THE COMMUNITY, EVEN AS I CHERISH AND RESPECT THE OPINION. THE REASON I RAISE THE ISSUE ABOUT DECIDING WHETHER OR NOT TO PLACE SOME ISSUES ON NOVEMBER'S BALLOT, IS BECAUSE I THINK SOME THINGS WARRANT IMMEDIATE REMEDY. CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM -- I THINK THAT'S AN IMPORTANT, SERIOUS ISSUE, AND IF WE DECIDE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH IT AT THE PUBLIC HEARING, I THINK THAT IS SOMETHING THAT NEEDS TO BE RESOLVED NOW, IMMEDIATELY, AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. MR. DAVIS SPOKE TO US ABOUT THE OATH OF OFFICE. I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING THAT NEEDS TO BE DECIDED AND MOVED FORWARD IMMEDIATELY, AND YOU MAY FEEL THAT WAY, AS WELL. SO REALLY, IT'S NOT MOVING FAST, AND IT'S NOT MOVING SLOW, IT'S WHAT IS NEEDED TO MAKE THE CHARTER WHAT IT NEEDS TO BE. SO IN THAT RESPECT, YOU KNOW, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM ON THIS NOVEMBER'S BALLOT. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE OATH OF OFFICE ON THIS NOVEMBER'S BALLOT. >>JAN SMITH: MR. WHITE, IF I COULD INTERRUPT YOU JUST A MINUTE; THE OATH OF OFFICE IS PROBABLY NOT SOMETHING THAT REQUIRES A CHARTER AMENDMENT, AND THIS BOARD COULD VERY EASILY PASS A RESOLUTION AND SEND IT TO THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS AND REQUEST THAT THEY CHANGE THE WAY THEY INDUCT THEIR OFFICERS, SWEAR THEM IN, AND I BELIEVE IT WOULD CARRY SUFFICIENT WEIGHT, AND I BELIEVE THAT IS SOMETHING WE SHOULD PUT FORTH AT THE VERY NEXT MEETING. >>GERALD WHITE: I WOULD LIKE TO MOVE THAT WE DO THAT NOW. I WOULD LIKE TO PLACE THAT IN THE FORM OF A MOTION. >> SECOND. >> WHAT'S YOUR WORDING YOU ARE PROPOSING? >>GERALD WHITE: INCLUDE THAT THEY BE SWORN TO DEFEND AND UPHOLD THE COUNTY CHARTER. >>JAN SMITH: OKAY. IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON THE MOTION? MR. LABOUR? >>STEVE LABOUR: NOT THAT I DON'T TRUST THE CHAIRMAN'S KNOWLEDGE OF HOW THAT MIGHT WORK, BUT SINCE WE DO HAVE A COUNTY ATTORNEY HERE, I WANT TO KNOW IF IN FACT WE CAN CAP THIS MOTION AND SUGGEST -- DOES IT HAVE ANY WEIGHT WITH THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS TO FORCE THEM TO CHANGE THE OATH? AND DO THEY HAVE TO -- IS IT A MAJORITY VOTE THAT WILL REQUIRE THAT, AND ET CETERA? >> MS. CAMPBELL: THIS BOARD CANNOT BIND THE COUNTY COMMISSION, EXCEPT AMENDING THE CHARTER THAT WOULD OBVIOUSLY BIND THEM TO DO ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. A RESOLUTION WOULD BE A WAY TO GET THAT TO THE BOARD'S ATTENTION. I DO NOT HAVE ANY REASON TO BELIEVE THAT THEY WOULD NOT GIVE THAT SERIOUS SKRAIGS. >> DO THEY HAVE THE POWER TO CHANGE THE OATH? >> WHAT I THINK THE CHAIR IS SAYING IS THE OATH THAT WE USE IS THE OATH THAT IS IN CONSTITUTION. THE CITY INSERTS THE CHARTER, I BELIEVE, WHEN SOMEONE TAKES THE OATH. BASICALLY IT'S ANOTHER LAYER RMT THE CONSTITUTION RECOGNIZES CHARTER GOVERNMENT. SO DO THE GENERAL LAWS OF THE STATE OF FLORIDA, RECOGNIZE THE CHARTER GOVERNMENT. SO INCLUDED BY IMPLICATION. ALL THAT WOULD BE DOING IS SAYING SPECIFICALLY "TO UPHOLD THE CHARTER." IT'S NOT CHANGING OR ADDING ANY BURDEN ON ANY PUBLIC OFFICIAL TAKING THE OATH. >> BUT THE BOARD HAS THE POWER TO CHANGE THEIR OWN OATH? >> THEY DO. IT'S ALREADY SUBSUMED IN WHAT THE CONSTITUTION PROVIDES. >> SO WE HAVE A MOTION ON THE FLOOR AND A SECOND. IS THERE ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? ALL IN FAVOR OF THE MOTION PLEASE SAY SAY E AYE? ANYONE OPPOSED, SAY NO. THE NO IS MS. WILLIAMS. MOTION MADE BY MR. WHITE, SECONDED BY MR. BALES. MS. MERIT, IF YOU WILL WORK WITH MARY HELEN CAMPBELL TO GET THAT WRITTEN AND TO GET THE BACK UP DETAIL SO WE CAN SIGN THE LETTER AND GET THAT OUT AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. AND THEN WE COPY ALL THE BOARD MEMBERS ON IT, PLEASE. THANK YOU. MR. WHITE? >>GERALD WHITE: WELL, TAKING THIS PROCESS VERY, VERY SERIOUSLY, I FEEL LIKE WE SHOULD MOVE FORWARD WITH CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM. >> MAY I SUGGEST THAT WE PUT THIS AS AN ISSUE TO BE VOTED UP AND DOWN AT THE NEXT MEETING? >>DEE WILLIAMS: I WENT BACK AND DID SOME RESEARCH IN THE LAST CHARTER, FIVE YEARS AGO. CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM CAME UP WITH THAT CHARTER. THAT IS DETERMINED BY STATE STATUTE, AND I THINK IT'S 103, BUT I CAN FIND THAT OUT. THERE IS NOTHING WE CAN DO WITH CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM. IT IS DETERMINED BY STATE LAW, AND THEY SET THE LIMITS, WHICH IS $500 PER PERSON. >>JAN SMITH: IT'S MY IMPRESSION THAT A LOCAL GOVERNMENT CAN BE MORE RESTRICTIVE BUT NOT INCREASE THOSE LIMITS. SO IF YOU HAD A $500 CAMPAIGN LIMIT AND WE WANTED TO SET A $250 LIMIT, WE COULD BE MORE RESTRICTIVE, AND I BELIEVE THAT'S THE WAY THE LAW IS, BUT TO SOLVE THIS ONE, WHY DON'T WE GET COPIES OF THE STATUTE THAT THIS RELATES TO THAT MS. WILLIAMS HAS REFERENCED, GET THAT INFORMATION. MS. MERITT, YOU ARE WRITING VERY QUICKLY OVER THERE. AND MS. CAMPBELL. >> ONE OR TWO COMMENTS ^ DEFINE, AND I CAN COME BACK WITH THAT CONSIDERATION. IT CANNOT BE INCONSISTENT WITH GENERAL LAW. THERE'S A GENERAL PROP CIRCUMSTANCE IF YOU ARE LESS RESTRICTIVE OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, GENERALLY YOU CAN DO THAT. THE CAMPAIGN CONTRIBUTION LIMIT, IF YOU LOWER IT, SOMEBODY CAN ARGUE THAT YOU ARE INCONSISTENT BECAUSE STATE LAW LETS ME RAISE 500, AND YOU ARE SAYING 250, AND BECAUSE IT IS SUCH A SPECIFIED AMOUNT IN THE STATE LAW, ANY CHANGE TO THAT, MIGHT BE INCONSISTENT. THAT IS NOT TO SAY THERE MIGHT BE OTHER THINGS, AND IT'S CHAPTER 106. THERE MIGHT BE OTHER THINGS IN THAT CHAPTER THAT THE BOARD MIGHT BE ABLE TO CHANGE THAT WOULDN'T BE SUCH A DIRECT MANDATED STATUTE BUT I WOULD BE HAPPY TO COME BACK AT THE NEXT MEETING WITH INFORMATION. >> THERE'S ALSO A POSITION THAT ANY LIMIT ON CAMPAIGNS IS A LIMIT ON FREE SPEECH, SO THERE'S AN ISSUE THERE, TOO. SO ANY INFORMATION THAT MS. MERITT AND MS. CAMPBELL CAN BRING UP REGARDING THE STATUTES THAT WE CAN REVIEW, PERHAPS THAT CAN BE AN ISSUE ON OUR AGENDA NEXT TIME. >> SINCE YOU MENTIONED FREE SPEECH, I BELIEVE THE U.S. SUPREME COURT HAS RULED ON LIMITS,. >> RECENTLY? >> YES, AND IT WAS UPHELD. I LIKE WHAT YOU ARE SAYING ABOUT THE WORKSHOPS AND THE \ROUND TABLE DISCUSSION. I HAVE SEEN THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS. I HAVE SEEN THE SCHOOL BOARD ENGAGE IN THAT TYPE OF DISCUSSION, AND IT'S BEEN VERY FRUITFUL, AND A LOT OF PROGRESS AS A RESULT OF THAT TYPE OF DIALOGUE. INCLUDING THAT PROCESS, WE NEED TO KEEP IN MIND -- I'M IN FAVOR OF KEEPING IN MIND THE ISSUES THAT NEED TO BE IN THE FOREFRONT. YOU WANT TO RESPECT THE COMMUNITY AND THE INPUT OF THE COMMUNITY, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, YOU WANT TO KEEP A BALANCE AND CONTINUE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH ISSUES, LIKE I WOULD LIKE TO SEE CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM ADDRESSED THIS YEAR. >>JAN SMITH: THANK YOU, MR. WHITE. MEMBERS, IT IS QUARTER AFTER 9, AND WE HAVE TO HEAR FROM THE PUBLIC. SO THIS IS THE ORDER. I HAVE WRITTEN THE NAMES DOWN. MR. TUTTLE, MR. BALLARD, MR. AMBLER, MS. WILLIAMS. I JUST PUT WILL. WE ARE CHANGING YOUR NAME THIS EVENING! AND THEN MR. HURLEY. >> AS LONG AS YOU GET IT RIGHT ON MY PAYCHECK. >> I APOLOGIZE (LAUGHTER). >> MS. TUTTLE? >>MARY LOU TUTTLE: I DON'T WANT TO BEAT A DEAD HORSE EITHER. I JUST WANT TO AGREE PUBLICLY WITH THOSE OF YOU WHO ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE FACT THAT WE ARE JUST MEETING AND THERE'S NO PUBLIC HERE. IF I WERE A MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC, I WOULDN'T COME OUT UNLESS IT WAS SOMETHING I SPECIFICALLY WANTED TO TALK ABOUT. I MEAN JUST A GENERALIZED COUNTY GOVERNMENT IS NOT GOING TO BRING ANYBODY OUT. WHEREAS, IF WE PUT SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT, TALK ABOUT NON-PARTISAN ELECTIONS, THAT WILL BRING A LOT OF PEOPLE OUT, BECAUSE THEY REALLY CARE ABOUT THAT. THAT MIGHT NOT REALLY CARE ABOUT THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR OR HOW MANY OFFICES HE'S ALLOWED TO HAVE, HOW MANY DEPARTMENTS HE'S ALLOWED TO HAVE. YOU KNOW, WHEN DOES THE BUDGET COME OUT? I DON'T THINK THAT BOTHERS THEM. BUT THERE'S PROBABLY AN ISSUE FOR EVERY GROUP THAT HAS SOME SERIOUS IN. >> HOW ABOUT WE INVITE ALL THE MEMBERS OF ALL THE VARIOUS PUBLICS TO A ROUND-TABLE DISCUSSION AND HAVE A FACILITATOR THAT WE WILL GET TO HEAR A AN AWFUL LOT FROM THE PUBLIC? THAT'S OUT THERE? I CAN TELL YOU AND I'M SURE MS. WILLIAMS CAN TELL YOU, IN THE PAST, YOU SEE THE SAME.... [TECHNICAL DIFFICULTIES] >> I DON'T THINK THAT THE LEADERSHIP OF THESE GROUPS THAT I AM TALKING ABOUT, THEY ARE GOING TO SEE IT'S THEIR OPPORTUNITY. I AGREE WE HAVE TO DO IT IN JUNE, WE HAVE TO DO IT SOON, FOR THEIR INPUT. BUT I THINK FOR THE END OF MAY IS TOO SOON. I DON'T THINK THAT'S ENOUGH TIME. >> AS DIFFICULT AS IT HAS BEEN TO SCHEDULE VARIOUS PEOPLE THAT WERE ON THAT LIST THAT WE ALL WANTED TO BE HERE, SOME OF THEM ARE SCHEDULED, AND I DON'T WANTED TO GO BACK AFTER THAT AND SAY, TOO BAD, WE HAVE DECIDED TO INVITE SOMEONE ELSE THIS EVENING. SO I THINK THE JUNE 1ST IS PROBABLY A GOOD TIME. MR. BALLARD, WE INTERRUPTED YOU. >>TERRY BALLARD: ARE YOU SAYING THE EARLY PART OF JUNE OR LATER PART OF JUNE? >> WE HAVE A MEETING SCHEDULED FOR JUNE 1ST. >>JAN SMITH: THAT'S WHAT I'M LOOKING FOR, THAT NIGHT. >>TERRY BALLARD: IS IT DOWN HERE OR WHAT? >>STEVE LABOUR: AGAIN, MY PERCEPTION IS THAT IF WE GIVE THEM ENOUGH ADVANCE, TELL THEM HOW IMPORTANT THE MEETING IS, AND IT'S GOING TO BE HERE, I THINK THAT, IF THEY REALLY WANT TO TALK TO US, IF THEY ARE REALLY CONCERNED ABOUT THE CHARTER REVIEW BOARD PROCESS, THEY WILL BE DOWN HERE. I ALSO SAY TO MY BOARD MEMBERS, IF THERE ARE ONLY FIVE PEOPLE THAT SHOW UP, IT IS IN THE A FAILURE. WE HAVE DONE OUR PART. >> YEAH, WE HAVE REACHED OUT >>STEVE LABOUR: WE HAVE REALLY REACHED OUT. TO TAG ONTO WHAT HAS HAPPENED IN THE PAST, I DON'T THINK THE BOARDS, IN ALL DUE RESPECT, HAVE BEEN AS PROACTIVE IN TRYING TO TOUCH THESE GROUPS THIS WAY. >> LET'S PUT IT THIS WAY. WE DIDN'T HAVE THE COMMUNICATIONS ABILITIES THEN THAT WE HAVE NOW. AS MUCH AS YOU MAY READ EDITORIALIZE FROM THE TRIBUNE AND ALL, THEY DON'T MANAGE TO COVER THE MEETINGS. DO YOU SEE A REPORTER HERE? AND YET, YOU KNOW, SO IT'S A PROBLEM. NEXT SPEAKING IS MR. AMBLER? >>KEVIN AMBLER: I WILL BE BRIEF BECAUSE IT IS GETTING LATE. I CERTAINLY DO NOT DISAGREE WITH MR. LABOUR. IN FACT, I AGREE THAT WE CERTAINLY NEED TO HAVE THE INPUT OF THE VARIOUS GROUPS AND THE MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC, BUT MY POSITION IS, YOU KNOW, IN THE IMMORTAL WORDS OF BILLY CRYSTAL, WHAT ARE WE, CHOPPED LIVER? THERE ARE 14 MEMBERS ON THIS BOARD. EVERY SINGLE PERSON ON THIS 14-PERSON BOARD HAVE CREDENTIALS, NOT JUST RESUME FILLERS, BUT MEANINGFUL INVOLVEMENT AND COMMITMENTS THAT THEY HAVE HAD TO THIS COMMITTEE. I REPRESENT 3,000 HOMEOWNERS IN THE NORTHDALE AREA ALONE. I HAVE BEEN SERVING ON BOARDS FOR TEN YEARS. I THINK I HAVE A PRETTY GOOD FEEL OF WHAT THE ISSUES ARE UP THERE FROM ALL THAT INVOLVEMENT. I DIDN'T JUST POP INTO HILLSBOROUGH COUNTY YESTERDAY. I THINK I CAN SIT HERE AT THIS TABLE AND MEANINGFULLY DISCUSS ISSUES WITH MY BOARD MEMBERS. THERE ARE 14 PEOPLE HERE. IT IS HARD TO GET 14 PEOPLE TO AGREE ON ANYTHING. AND YOU WANTED A THOUSAND MORE? WILL TO GET ANYTHING MEANINGFUL DONE -- I MAKE A MOTION THAT WE LIMIT, IF WE ARE GOING TO HAVE INPUT, AND I THINK IT'S A GOOD THING, WE LIMIT TO NO MORE THAN ONE HOUR THE AMOUNT OF PUBLIC OR INVITED INPUT. NOW, PUBLIC INPUT IS DIFFERENT. THAT'S OUR COMMENT PERIOD AT THE BEGINNING AND END. I'M TALKING ABOUT OUR INVITED GUESTS, WHETHER THEY BE A CIVIC ASSOCIATION, OR THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR, BUT WE NEED TO PUT A CAP ON THAT, SO THAT WE HAVE ENOUGH TIME REMAINING AT THE MEETINGS THAT WE HAVE SET, TO DISCUSS AMONG OURSELVES THE ISSUES, IF WE WANT TO GET SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT, WE CAN DO SO. YOU SEE, BY TAKING UP ALL OF OUR TIME WITH TALK, DE FACTO PUTTING SOMETHING ON THE BALLOT WINS. WE ARE FRUSTRATED, THOSE OF US WHO WANT TO MOVE FORWARD. >> TRIAL BY DELAY? >> I WANT TO DISCUSS THIS. I AM GETTING READY TO WITHDRAW IT. >> HE HAS A MOTION. YOU HAVE SECONDED IT. NOW I WILL OPEN IT TO BOARD DISCUSSION. >> THANK YOU, MADA